Auto Dark thoughts

Deacon

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I assume nothing in the beta is secret, so I’m hoping it’s cool to discuss it here.

I always run my R3 in Dark Mode. Other than a blinking dot it’s completely quiet unless and until an alert appears. Even if an alert is a lockout or otherwise manually muted or automuted, it displays.

In the new beta option for V1 Display Mode to be set to Auto, it displays the mode (C, A, L, little L, etc) at all times unless and until there’s a muted alert of any sort (or rather only muted alerts, no unmuted alerts), at which time the display blanks out entirely. That’s a cool move in a good direction for those who don’t like their V1 lit up for every lockout they encounter. However, I think there’s a refinement or two (maybe optional) that would be nice.

First, an idea. I imagine it’s probably not possible, but since both generations have a dot, is it possible to tell the V1 to light up the dot only, rather than displaying the mode normally? This would provide reassurance both that the detector is on and that V1Driver is actively controlling it. But I don’t know if the API even provides such a function. Perhaps a whisper in their ear might nudge them in that direction?

One thing I immediately noticed is that I use AutoMute for both K and Ka (X disabled). I have it set to 3 seconds. However, that means the display blanks out entirely, even when facing a Ka threat that could be growing, shrinking, or changing direction after passing it. This would be OK if I were running V1Driver in the foreground and could monitor it visually that way, but I almost never do that. Might it be possible to only blank out the display if a signal is muted based on certain criteria, such as a lockout or Savvy, maybe even K auto snooze (still not fully clear on how that works/decides), but not a simple AutoMute? Maybe even selectable by band? I do face legit K threats, so I’d actually prefer that non-lockout, non-Savvy, non-BSM snoozes be left visible on the display, along with Ka, but I imagine for some users a simple band selection would be sufficient.

Also, I would personally prefer the detector to simply remain dark at all times rather than displaying the analyzer mode when idle. Or rather I’d love the dot, but I doubt that’s an option currently. Essentially if the detector can run dark while being controlled by V1Driver, I know that if I am seeing the mode displayed V1Driver is not connected, or if it’s gone blank I know it’s in V1Driver’s capable hands. I can see where the more paranoid among us might prefer the current behavior so they don’t think somehow the detector died, but I have no qualms about that.

Anyway, just some feedback and ideas.
 

jdong

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I really agree with the point about Auto Dark hiding AutoMuted signals being suboptimal— 8 seconds into a Ka alert I don’t want to stop seeing it on the screen.

I am personally happy with the behavior that it shows the L and Bluetooth icon when not actively suppressing anything. This is safer because if the app dies for whatever reason it would otherwise leave the screen dark.

I would advise some ability to exclude AutoMute from Auto Dark.... almost every other reason for V1Driver to mute seems reasonable for turning the screen off.
 

Deacon

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This is safer because if the app dies for whatever reason it would otherwise leave the screen dark.
Is that how it works? If so I could understand the concern, though I don’t think I’ve ever had that happen, so I’m not super concerned about it (and you’d still get audio either way).

On the Gen2 there’s a Bluetooth icon that would supplement that, but not on my Gen1. Unless @mswlogo confirms with a known answer, I might try to get a few minutes to go test out what happens when a display is darkened by an app but then becomes disconnected. I would imagine if that happens the V1 reverts to its default display, but maybe it’s just a switch that gets flipped and stays that way.
 

jdong

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Is that how it works? If so I could understand the concern, though I don’t think I’ve ever had that happen, so I’m not super concerned about it (and you’d still get audio either way).
That is how I understand it to work from the API documentation. It doesn't look like the go-dark API has a built in un-darken if the app disconnects, unlike the physical concealed display logic. I haven't tried it yet though.

On the Gen2 there’s a Bluetooth icon that would supplement that, but not on my Gen1. Unless @mswlogo confirms with a known answer, I might try to get a few minutes to go test out what happens when a display is darkened by an app but then becomes disconnected. I would imagine if that happens the V1 reverts to its default display, but maybe it’s just a switch that gets flipped and stays that way.
Unfortunately I can confirm that dark mode darkens the bluetooth LED too. The screen looks totally indistinguishable from OFF.

Leaving on the BT or leaving on a dot are both really good enhancement requests and since the V1 is software updatable now, anything is possible :)
 

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Ah... that's what I've been seeing. I was wondering why Ka alerts were being darkened. I would strongly vote to have it only darken on "locked out" signals, not on signals that get auto muted after time.

I would advise some ability to exclude AutoMute from Auto Dark.... almost every other reason for V1Driver to mute seems reasonable for turning the screen off.
This! I don't like how AutoMute causes it to go dark. I would think ONLY lockouts would cause it to go dark. Other than that, I really love this new functionality.

-Mark
 

OBeerWANKenobi

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I totally thought this thread would be about something else.

AutoDarkThoughts.jpg


Sorry, @Deacon , I just couldn't help myself.
 

mswlogo

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I really agree with the point about Auto Dark hiding AutoMuted signals being suboptimal— 8 seconds into a Ka alert I don’t want to stop seeing it on the screen.

I am personally happy with the behavior that it shows the L and Bluetooth icon when not actively suppressing anything. This is safer because if the app dies for whatever reason it would otherwise leave the screen dark.

I would advise some ability to exclude AutoMute from Auto Dark.... almost every other reason for V1Driver to mute seems reasonable for turning the screen off.
I can certainly see the argument for excluding AutoMute and I fixed that.

I think it's important to have a "Pilot light" that the detector is running.

Lot's of users use cigarette lighter adapters and work lose etc. Or V1's that go dead, like that ever happens ;)
Or you can lose Bluetooth connection while the display is off and nothing will turn it back on.
Lose connection is not that uncommon, but losing it in the middle of a mute would be pretty low.

I think it's a compromise of not being annoying while things are being locked out and still being "fail safe".
 

thefrog1394

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I second @Deacon request and would prefer dark mode while standby as well as actively muting. Understood that this creates a case where the detector remains dark upon disconnect, but that would be a risk I’m willing to take personally. Could this be an option? Like when auto mode is enabled there are selectable options for which the display should be on/off?

I’d actually personally prefer the display to also light up during savvy mutes. It seems relevant to know there is, say, a growing Ka band signal ahead even if below the savvy threshold to ensure I know not to speed up too much.

So personally I’d vote dark during GPS mute and idle and on all other times. But given that others may prefer differently, I’d love a customizable auto setting.

Anyways, loving the new feature thanks for the continued improvements!
 

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That’s why I default Savvy off on Ka. I want to see it. Since it’s not to often and I can still do stupid things below savvy, like push a yellow light or not come to a full stop at a stop sign.

To me, what you put under savvy is the most straight forward safe muting there is and I probably won’t want to see it either.

Some people might want risk leaving the screen dark but I don’t want to be responsible for everyone that might not understand the risk.

Try it for a while and see how it is.
 

Vortex

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Thanks for both the suggestion and the update regarding automute! That was a great idea. :)
 

Deacon

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Some people might want risk leaving the screen dark but I don’t want to be responsible for everyone that might not understand the risk.

Try it for a while and see how it is.
I’ve run it for maybe 300 or so miles like that so far. I dislike it enough that if full dark isn’t an option, then no big deal, I’ll just switch it back to default and try to forget what might’ve been :)

What risk are you talking about? Even if the app crashed or something, which thankfully I’m not aware of having experienced ever, so what? When it launches again it takes back over. If I want, I can fire up the V1connection app. Even in the worst possible case scenario it’s temporarily darkened at best, and you still have audio.

It’s a risk I’m more than willing to take.
 

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Seriously this is one of the best apps I've bought. @mswlogo thank you so much for taking customer feedback and incorporating it thoughtfully!


What risk are you talking about? Even if the app crashed or something, which thankfully I’m not aware of having experienced ever, so what? When it launches again it takes back over. If I want, I can fire up the V1connection app. Even in the worst possible case scenario it’s temporarily darkened at best, and you still have audio.
That's one of my worries... I mainly use V1Driver in my pocket so I wouldn't know if it crashed other than by encountering a darkened alert at volume. Sure I can launch the app again once I realize but that makes me feel uneasy.

But the BIGGEST risk is what if the cigarette plug came loose? A lot of us with the newer European style 12V sockets have it loosen over time. Full Dark looks identical to OFF. If VR implemented your suggestion to leave a dot or bluetooth icon lit, then I wouldn't worry, but right now there's no way to tell if your Full Dark V1 is On or Off.

Maybe "Auto Full Dark" as a separate mode would be cool to implement if that's not too many options, but from my personal standpoint the current Auto Dark is exactly the behavior that I would like and I would be sad to see that go away in favor of a different operating mode.
 

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I would definitely not get rid of the existing mode but only consider adding another.
It does getting little crazy with the number options.
I add an option and for every 1 that likes it I lose 10 because they get overwhelmed.
Remember why Valentine got rid of the Lever? Because that was a major reason for support calls.

One customer recently posted here and had been running V1Driver on his V1 Gen1 sucessfully.
He wanted to run without it on Gen2 which his fine, but he didn't know how to remove an App from his Phone !!!

That is your Average V1 user. Then other users that want to twist every knob not knowing what it does.
 

Deacon

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But the BIGGEST risk is what if the cigarette plug came loose? A lot of us with the newer European style 12V sockets have it loosen over time. Full Dark looks identical to OFF. If VR implemented your suggestion to leave a dot or bluetooth icon lit, then I wouldn't worry, but right now there's no way to tell if your Full Dark V1 is On or Off.
I’ve never had any such issues with my hardwires, but to be clear I’m not begrudging you the option to have the detector display active until it blanks out. It’s just that it’s not a great option for the way I use it.

Maybe "Auto Full Dark" as a separate mode would be cool to implement
Yeah, that’s really all I’m looking for. It could look like this, just adding a Dark mode.

On, Exclusive, Off, Auto, Dark
 

jdong

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I would definitely not get rid of the existing mode but only consider adding another.
It does getting little crazy with the number options.
I add an option and for every 1 that likes it I lose 10 because they get overwhelmed.
Remember why Valentine got rid of the Lever? Because that was a major reason for support calls.

One customer recently posted here and had been running V1Driver on his V1 Gen1 sucessfully.
He wanted to run without it on Gen2 which his fine, but he didn't know how to remove an App from his Phone !!!

That is your Average V1 user. Then other users that want to twist every knob not knowing what it does.

I'll be perfectly honest: I launched JBV1 for the first time and was quite overwhelmed.

V1Driver was also a bit overwhelming but it did the bulk of what I wanted out of the box -- this is one of those situations where sensible defaults might be the best way to not overwhelm a new owner.

Perhaps a solution here is to have some sort of welcome wizard that asks you a few simple questions or choose from 2 or 3 pre-canned sets of settings, based off what you feel most users would want.


(Ok I'll go back to my day job and stop making more work for you :D )
 

thefrog1394

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I would definitely not get rid of the existing mode but only consider adding another.
It does getting little crazy with the number options.
I add an option and for every 1 that likes it I lose 10 because they get overwhelmed.
Remember why Valentine got rid of the Lever? Because that was a major reason for support calls.

One customer recently posted here and had been running V1Driver on his V1 Gen1 sucessfully.
He wanted to run without it on Gen2 which his fine, but he didn't know how to remove an App from his Phone !!!

That is your Average V1 user. Then other users that want to twist every knob not knowing what it does.
To be honest, I think V1Driver already has enough options that anything other than "out of the box" use is intimidating for a first time user. Unless you stripped about 80% of the options out, I think you are already losing users who aren't willing to spend some time with it.

Something to consider would be hiding some of the options behind an advanced mode. This gives you the best of both worlds.


That’s why I default Savvy off on Ka. I want to see it. Since it’s not to often and I can still do stupid things below savvy, like push a yellow light or not come to a full stop at a stop sign.

To me, what you put under savvy is the most straight forward safe muting there is and I probably won’t want to see it either.

Some people might want risk leaving the screen dark but I don’t want to be responsible for everyone that might not understand the risk.

Try it for a while and see how it is.
Good point on Ka band Savvy being disabled by default, that makes sense. I disagree hiding Savvy alerts still though for this reason - stationary falses will eventually be locked out by GPS even below the Savvy threshold. So theoretically any Savvy signal, in an area where you drive often, should be real. Savvy is nice to keep things quiet in new areas or when below the speed limit and I don't care about radar presence. But IMO GPS is the only "known false" signal, and thus the only one that should be both visually and audibly muted. Not a deal breaker for me at all, but that's my view at least.
 

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One customer recently posted here and had been running V1Driver on his V1 Gen1 sucessfully.
He wanted to run without it on Gen2 which his fine, but he didn't know how to remove an App from his Phone !!!

That is your Average V1 user. Then other users that want to twist every knob not knowing what it does.
As someone who is in the tech field and has numerous experiences being a power user, one of the biggest learning curves of the V1Driver app was actually knowing what every feature does or doesn't do. The user doesn't know what every feature is until a large help bubble appears after the desired option is changed.

Documentation that doesn't require the user to toggle a switch or change a value by pressing a 'question mark' next to the desired option to open the help bubble or documentation on the app website will go a long way in aiding with overall positive UI/UX experience.

The app is touted around here as a "set and forget it" type of application, and it's not just in the V1 subforum alone. It's mentioned in every subforum, even in the competitor's subforums. With this forum growing in size, V1Driver being the only good iOS app, and radar detectors being more in the limelight to those who see it as a get out of jail card rather than a tool, the number of help inquiries will only increase. In fact, this will only add to the amount of users who want to know what every option or feature does that earns the V1Driver its "set and forget" attitude. Because remember, a tool is only as good as its operator.

This is in no way me saying the app is not critical or useless in any way. V1Driver is the reason why I bought the V1C LE in the first place for my Gen1, and being an iOS user, it's the only app that really works and does what it says... only after you know what you're getting yourself into. Again, a tool is only as good as its operator. I think most of it is already intuitive and helpful with the "Suppress/Keep" recommendations at first start up, I feel that same window should appear at user discretion at any desired time when they are questioning an option in the app. I love the AI attitude with it, and the way locksout are implemented, but others might just see it as luxury when the detector itself is already $500.
 

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As someone who is in the tech field and has numerous experiences being a power user, one of the biggest learning curves of the V1Driver app was actually knowing what every feature does or doesn't do. The user doesn't know what every feature is until a large help bubble appears after the desired option is changed.

Documentation that doesn't require the user to toggle a switch or change a value by pressing a 'question mark' next to the desired option to open the help bubble or documentation on the app website will go a long way in aiding with overall positive UI/UX experience.

The app is touted around here as a "set and forget it" type of application, and it's not just in the V1 subforum alone. It's mentioned in every subforum, even in the competitor's subforums. With this forum growing in size, V1Driver being the only good iOS app, and radar detectors being more in the limelight to those who see it as a get out of jail card rather than a tool, the number of help inquiries will only increase. In fact, this will only add to the amount of users who want to know what every option or feature does that earns the V1Driver its "set and forget" attitude. Because remember, a tool is only as good as its operator.

This is in no way me saying the app is not critical or useless in any way. V1Driver is the reason why I bought the V1C LE in the first place for my Gen1, and being an iOS user, it's the only app that really works and does what it says... only after you know what you're getting yourself into. Again, a tool is only as good as its operator. I think most of it is already intuitive and helpful with the "Suppress/Keep" recommendations at first start up, I feel that same window should appear at user discretion at any desired time when they are questioning an option in the app. I love the AI attitude with it, and the way locksout are implemented, but others might just see it as luxury when the detector itself is already $500.
And once you DO know how the app works how much value do all those question mark buttons add to the functioning of the app? Would you prefer more cryptic labels or smaller buttons harder to hit? I prioritized having Labels large, clear and descriptive with dynamic units. So there is less need to look at the help, especially after you do learn the app.

Even a question mark needs some hit space around it. You’d probably lose 10-15% of the screen. That becomes useless real estate. But they could be dynamic.

Some apps will do an overlay the first time they come up explaining stuff. But that’s tough to absorb everything at once.

Also keep in mind it needs to run on screens as small as an iPhone SE.

And where do all the question marks go on the main screen?

There is plenty I’d like to do. Plenty of ways to skin the cat. But it takes a lot of time. Some of it is based on 3rd party libraries that there might be better alternatives for.
 

jdong

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As long as the default set of options are sensible, having additional customization inside menus is totally fine. In fact, without that, there will always be a vocal 5-10% of the customer base who feel like the app doesn't do what they want, and you can see how much that has spooked a larger fraction of the customer base into thinking they don't want to try the app.

I think the options and help interface is fine -- it's relatively easy to hit a toggle and undo the toggle with no ill effect after you learn what it does. That is one of the fundamental underpinnings of the iOS/Apple interface guideline -- options are reversible and the user should not feel scared to hit an option toggle to test out what it does.

The one piece of feedback I have though is for the main screen... in the heat of an alert, I don't remember what all the gestures do -- swiping, tapping, holding, etc.

Sometimes I feel like you might be better off with a grid of icons, or maybe having Mute be a dynamic label that changes from Mute to GPS Mute or something when you tap it, to more simulate the Escort UI around the Mute button.

At any rate, I'm not a UI designer, just as a user, my only interface feedback is that the main screen can be a bit confusing due to hidden gestures.

For the overall app, my thoughts earlier still stick, I think having a wizard or other way to choose between a set of pre-set options would capture 90%+ of what users want without having them dig through all of the options.
 

63run

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So what does exclusive do in this new version of v1driver?
 

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