Tests that show how much installing behind a grill impacts performance

STS-134

Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Mar 6, 2014
Messages
10,324
Reaction score
11,269
Location
Saratoga, CA
X2 to the 10th power!! Go to any of the forums I visit, including the MB and others (Porsche) and you'll see that the Stinger is indeed highly recommended, BUT when many guys hear the price, they too have many questions about that.(consternation to some). (Some of these guys are my friends who think of nothing in spending $125K or more on a car). Recent case in point. Neighbor 1 gets a 2015 991 TT S for close to $200 K (new car). Other neighbor 2 sports a metallic Blue 2015 ZO-6 (C7 series) with all the performance options. Car # 1 is $200,000, Car # 2 is $105,000 out the door. Neighbors # 1 and 2 debate all the time about the cost/price/performance ratio that each car garners. Car 2 is about 99% of the performance of Car # 1 because Car # 1 has AWD so its qtr mile is a lil better. ON the track, car # 2 has recently been beating the snot in time out of Car # 1 because of the Performance Package and ground effects. So, the ultimate issue is, what did Car # 1 get for his additional $100 K that car # 2 did not offer??
Part of the reason people buy a Porsche is because it's a recognized brand. People in general, even ones who don't know or care about cars, will go "Wow, you're driving a Porsche!" People who do know about cars will go "Oh wow, you're driving a 991 Turbo S!" Some people find value in brand recognition and well, basically the ability to show off. Other people who only care about performance and don't care about other people knowing that they're driving an expensive car will go for the GT-R, which can basically perform up to the 991TTS level but my parents would be able to walk right by one and think it's your typical $30000 Nissan.

This is really the problem with expensive CMs. I could probably bring 100 strangers into my car and not one of them would go "Oh, wow, you use a Stinger!" More likely, they'd see the system and go "What's that?" I get that reaction to my ALPs all the time after the voice announces "Interference defense active" when I start the car. People really have no clue what it is, what it does, or how much it cost me to buy and install, and even after I tell them, most of the engineers are interested in how it works, and the rest just don't care. If no one knew what a Porsche was, then I highly doubt that anyone would spend $200k on one instead of a $105k GT-R.
 
Last edited:

PointerCone

M3 Kng
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
22,342
Reaction score
22,615
There's waayyy to much typing on my retort to the many blah I see here, so I'll leave it as I mentioned in my previous post which you all missed, i.e., I look forward to a behind the bumper test!

As far as the Mustang winner goes never did I say SHILL, so stop trying to twist this into something other than my point, i.e., said winner perspective to anything other than an Escort will be skewed. Unlike most of you I call it like I see it, so no there will be no apology as it is what it is.





Sent from Tapatalk
With all due respect, where have I skewed my Stinger review??? The only one I've seen in the raw was Mnbadger and his was impressive despite it failing to alert to 35.5 and the fact that it was mid pack on other tests. I ran it with him, in his car and while the rear mounted patch behind the bumper was HOT, the front did not do so great. The old style lidar was IPT on a TSs and Ultralyte ( old guns) at 1100 feet. For the record , I have not tested any other than Mnbadger unit.

Why are you deflecting here? Let's just put this to bed and test the patch behind a grill and bumper. What's to fear?
 

v1user

Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Feb 13, 2011
Messages
6,203
Reaction score
4,434
I have never in my life, encountered as much drama from men, than I have since joining the ECM community. And that's all I have to say about that.
X2. That's why I'm thinking about having it cut off and joining hgtv.com

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk
 

mrkookm

Advanced User
Joined
Apr 16, 2011
Messages
2,656
Reaction score
1,870
With all due respect, where have I skewed my Stinger review??? The only one I've seen in the raw was Mnbadger and his was impressive despite it failing to alert to 35.5 and the fact that it was mid pack on other tests. I ran it with him, in his car and while the rear mounted patch behind the bumper was HOT, the front did not do so great. The old style lidar was IPT on a TSs and Ultralyte ( old guns) at 1100 feet. For the record , I have not tested any other than Mnbadger unit.

Why are you deflecting here? Let's just put this to bed and test the patch behind a grill and bumper. What's to fear?

Never did I mention a fear of anything where are you getting this nonsense from? Whatever was said has to do with the most recent tests from Vortex and my point was to mount it so that the VIP wouldn't be hindered to get an accurate representation of where in the overall scheme of things the VIP stood. You on the other hand vehemently opposed to this idea because your reasoning was that it's marketed as a remote so it should be mounted behind a bumper?! Which radar detector test that we've ever done we had an STIRO 'the Benchmark of remotes and at one time WS' was ever mounted BEHIND A BUMPER? So yeah you being and fan of Escort had me wondering why on earth would you want to put the Stinger VIP behind the bumper?! That shit puzzled me? Clearly that wouldn't be fair and you should've known better! So stop trying to make it seem like I'm trying to hide anything.

You're preaching attenuation as if it's something new in this game. That's nothing new! It's why back in the day when after a select few here (me included) helped showed what real performance was like and helped started the STIRO craze. At that time we recommended to install on on the bumper with the horn unobstructed. Unobstructed does NOT mean behind the bumper, so for the Stinger I was ensuring / suggesting it was installed correctly as I did when I had the STIRO. Here you a running with this idea that there is a problem with the Stinger behind the bumper because your experience is with that of an less than ideal install of a unit behind a grill which is worse than a unit installed behind a bumper. Of course the performance would be impacted!

Not sure why you're bringing up obsolete lidar experiences, but in case you weren't aware the Stinger VIP with the new laser hardware can jam ALL guns! Or do you want to hear it from mirage and redredrocket as well :)

It's just a matter of time before you see what you are asking so simmer down there bud. There's nothing to hide man, this isn't Escort :)



Sent from Tapatalk
 
Last edited:

PointerCone

M3 Kng
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
22,342
Reaction score
22,615
Never did I mention a fear of anything where are you getting this nonsense from? Whatever was said has to do with the most recent tests from Vortex and my point was to mount it so that the VIP wouldn't be hindered to get an accurate representation of where in the overall scheme of things the VIP stood. You on the other hand vehemently opposed to this idea because your reasoning was that it's marketed as a remote so it should be mounted behind a bumper?! Which radar detector test that we've ever done we had an STIRO 'the Benchmark of remotes and at one time WS' was ever mounted BEHIND A BUMPER? So yeah you being and fan of Escort had me wondering why on earth would you want to put the Stinger VIP behind the bumper?! That $#@! puzzled me? Clearly that wouldn't be fair and you should've known better! So stop trying to make it seem like I'm trying to hide anything.

You're preaching attenuation as if it's something new in this game. That's nothing new! It's why back in the day when after a select few here (me included) helped showed what real performance was like and helped started the STIRO craze. At that time we recommended to install on on the bumper with the horn unobstructed. Unobstructed does NOT mean behind the bumper, so for the Stinger I was ensuring / suggesting it was installed correctly as I did when I had the STIRO. Here you a running with this idea that there is a problem with the Stinger behind the bumper because your experience is with that of an less than ideal install of a unit behind a grill which is worse than a unit installed behind a bumper. Of course the performance would be impacted!

Not sure why you're are bring up obsolete lidar experiences, but in case you weren't aware the Stinger VIP can jam ALL guns! Or do you want to hear it from mirage and redredrocket as well :)

It's just a matter of time before you see what you are asking so simmer down there bud. There's nothing to hide man, this isn't Escort :)

In deference to BOB (VG) it was he that got me on the Stir-O and its band segmentation (& the Sti Driver) craze many years ago.



Back on Topic: If you look at the Stinger manual: Version 1.0 Page 7, Stinger specifically states (verbatim): " Vertically place the antenna behind the grill, bumper or spoiler with the smooth surface facing forward."

Page 10 goes on with diagrams:


Place the HD Antenna at the front of the car
behind the bumper or spoiler, preferably

behind flat and smooth plastic. Do NOT install
the HD antenna behind metal, shaped plastic, or
honeycomb grills. *** (my bold emphasis added).



I don't think it gets any clearer than this. ^ ^ ^

Why so hesitant to test it like this, as THIS ^ ^ ^ is how a shop is GOING to install it in a clients car..........

In perusing the manual, NO WHERE does it state that the front patch is to be mounted "outside" the vehicle bumper. Remember, we're talking a "test" here, not an actual install. One can install it anyway they like and hopefully, for both best protection of the patch and best performance.

Reference: https://www.stingerradarusa.com/image/data/manuals/STINGER_VIP_US.pdf
 
Last edited:

mrkookm

Advanced User
Joined
Apr 16, 2011
Messages
2,656
Reaction score
1,870
You clearly haven't been reading my posts, so i'm not going to waste anymore finger clicks on an otherwise non-issue. If you feel any better trying to hold onto something that's not really then do as you must! It's just a matter of time before your questions are answered :) . Maybe then you'll move onto to better things as I did :)





Sent from Tapatalk
 

RedRocket

Lidar Shootist
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Corgi Lovers
Advanced User
Joined
Apr 10, 2012
Messages
4,836
Reaction score
6,128
Location
USA
Back on Topic: If you look at the Stinger manual: Version 1.0 Page 7, Stinger specifically states (verbatim): " Vertically place the antenna behind the grill, bumper or spoiler with the smooth surface facing forward."

Page 10 goes on with diagrams:
Ouch, heard that coup de grace shot way up here in Boston.
 

PointerCone

M3 Kng
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
22,342
Reaction score
22,615
Ouch, heard that coup de grace shot way up here in Boston.


I am missing Newton Centre this time of year near BC :):) [MENTION=1677]RedRocket[/MENTION]
 

Higado de Acero

Whisky is liquid sunshine.
Advanced User
Joined
Mar 11, 2012
Messages
2,894
Reaction score
1,826
Location
Antofagasta, Chile. The driest desert in the world
X2. That's why I'm thinking about having it cut off and joining hgtv.com

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

X3

You all are starting to sound like my naggin wife.
 

RedRocket

Lidar Shootist
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Corgi Lovers
Advanced User
Joined
Apr 10, 2012
Messages
4,836
Reaction score
6,128
Location
USA
I am missing Newton Centre this time of year near BC :):) [MENTION=1677]RedRocket[/MENTION]
Near BC ?
You're a married man, knock it off about college girls, my friend !
 

hiddencam

Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Oct 29, 2010
Messages
11,786
Reaction score
26,700
Winning a Mustang or not, Pointer calls it like it is, and if you'd have read his posts over the years you'd have realized that. But wait, you've been around long enough to know that... Anyway, pretty unfair and mean-spirited innuendo mrkookm. Pointer is an enthusiast first. If he praises a particular escort product, that's because it deserves it. And I've seen him criticize escort plenty. And praise V1 when it held the crown. And he's already agreed numerous times that Stinger is currently the best. Winning that car hasn't seemed to have skewed his perspective.
 

mrkookm

Advanced User
Joined
Apr 16, 2011
Messages
2,656
Reaction score
1,870
Winning a Mustang or not, Pointer calls it like it is, and if you'd have read his posts over the years you'd have realized that. But wait, you've been around long enough to know that... Anyway, pretty unfair and mean-spirited innuendo mrkookm. Pointer is an enthusiast first. If he praises a particular escort product, that's because it deserves it. And I've seen him criticize escort plenty. And praise V1 when it held the crown. And he's already agreed numerous times that Stinger is currently the best. Winning that car hasn't seemed to have skewed his perspective.

Again, I'm calling it as I see it. You might not feel or see it that way, but to each their own.

Looking forward to seeing a behind the grill or bumper tests. I only wish I hadn't sold my STIRO.




Sent from Tapatalk
 
Last edited:

PointerCone

M3 Kng
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
22,342
Reaction score
22,615
Again, I'm calling it as I see it. You might not feel or see it that way, but to each their own.

Looking forward to seeing a behind the grill or bumper tests. I only wish I hadn't sold my STIRO.




Sent from Tapatalk

i have two Stir-O, one of which if I remove from my car, I could send to @Vortex for testing. Regardless, I feel that the Stinger behind the grill will probably meet or beat the O , but that's not the issue. How would a " normally" mounted Stinger ( per page 7 and 10 of the installation manual) do against itself when not mounted in open. In other words, the OP here is raising that question. I am not so sure that it would " smoke" Old Nellie in Ka testing. Every Stinger test thus far has been mounted in cabin WS style or in the open (Vortex style). Save for Mnbadgers results.

Lets take V1 , ER and every other RD out of this test. How does mounting position of Stinger patch make a difference??? That's what We All would love to know??
 
Last edited:

Vortex

Making Videos
Observer
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Corgi Lovers
Advanced User
Joined
Jul 19, 2012
Messages
21,133
Reaction score
54,582
Location
Washington State

PointerCone

M3 Kng
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
22,342
Reaction score
22,615
That is fantastic. Thank you so much!! :thumbsup:

and that honeycomb grill, holy cow...

Since the distances are in meters, looks like the haircut (per the installation manual) is not that bad, BUT like you stated ^ ^ ^ , a honeycomb grill takes the scalp off the unit.

thanks [MENTION=129]nano[/MENTION] for sharing. So, if I may extrapolate from this, the Stinger NOT in the open take a mild to moderate to severe haircut when mounted behind something, from mild behind bumper (about 100 feet) to 50% behind a honeycomb grill.
 

JackBurton

Learning to Fly
Beginner User
Joined
Feb 17, 2013
Messages
117
Reaction score
78
That's one of the major rubs against the Stinger for me. I don't care what the performance is, I'm not going to mount that ugly patch antenna on the outside of my car. If it can't perform being recessed or hidden behind something it's of no use to me. I'd love to see what kind of difference the mounting makes.
 

mrkookm

Advanced User
Joined
Apr 16, 2011
Messages
2,656
Reaction score
1,870
That's one of the major rubs against the Stinger for me. I don't care what the performance is, I'm not going to mount that ugly patch antenna on the outside of my car. If it can't perform being recessed or hidden behind something it's of no use to me. I'd love to see what kind of difference the mounting makes.

I wouldn't install it out their either and you don't have to!

I've had an STIRO longer than most on here and installed the antenna in every possible location on my car...even have pictures to back that up, not just talk. As expected when installed behind a bumper or behind uneven surfaces will affect how the unit receives radar and the performance drops accordingly even on the mighty horn based STIRO.

The VIP has been installed behind the upper grill, lower bumper recessed 'mounted on radiator mount', and mounted more forward and the unit still performs very well when being ran alongside the STIRO. Mind you this was even before the unit gained the performance it currently has. This is why I know recessed works, but you guys will figure this out for yourselves in time :)







Sent from Tapatalk
 
Last edited:

PointerCone

M3 Kng
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
22,342
Reaction score
22,615
That's one of the major rubs against the Stinger for me. I don't care what the performance is, I'm not going to mount that ugly patch antenna on the outside of my car. If it can't perform being recessed or hidden behind something it's of no use to me. I'd love to see what kind of difference the mounting makes.

Nano's tests were done on a K band unit, so it may not be telling for us on Ka band. It does tell me , however, that the Stinger does indeed take a haircut in performance (however mild or moderate you may want to define it) when mounted behind a bumper (as I have long suspected and saw in MnBadgers install) or grill. At a minimum, its 100 feet or more behind the bumper and about 50% behind a grill. I'm not saying that a traditional horn like the ci or Stir-O don't also take a haircut, BUT the Stinger according to Nano's tests most certainly does when mounted per the installers manual. \

Yes, [MENTION=14]mrkookm[/MENTION], I am well aware of your various mounting positions with the O over the years, including, BUT not limited to high and low and also inside the cabin and behind glass. Fact is, ANY remote is going to be adversely affected by mounting position and that includes the O and the Stinger.
 

Discord Server

Latest threads

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
90,714
Messages
1,380,724
Members
22,810
Latest member
tdelkins40
Top