Falcon HR vs. The Best of the Best Test - DC Fluid Aug 22/2021

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Nice work…again. It’s nice to see the rl360 hitting the off axis K, like a champ, since I still see a lot of that here. I will say that if I needed mrcd, I’d prob toss it out the window. Like that the unit is all inclusive, without having to hook it up to any third party software, but it stinks it up on the mrcd. Works for me…all that matters.
 

Mithheru

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If anyone can't seem to find the 133 US firmware anymore, a copy of it is now here (without the GPS DB included, so you don't have to replace you currently installed database which is probably more recent).
 

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DC Fluid

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If anyone can't seem to find the 133 US firmware anymore, a copy of it is now here (without the GPS DB included, so you don't have to replace you currently installed database which is probably more recent).
I was going to PM you but this works!
Thank you.
 

Bossdad71

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Thanks for taking the time to run this test. As a G2 owner I'm of course disappointed!
like @Rags said, it's just one test, and it sounds like the weather might have been a factor. detectors can be finicky, kinda like my wife... lol
 

rmarella

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Good evening RDF,
Today I got a late start but got some good K Band testing done.
Not as much as I was planning due to weather creating unfair conditions, as I know a rain storm really cuts down range.
Both the R7s and the R360c had some runs with light rain or damp pavement.
I called it quits when a more serious shower came.

The setup:
Falcon HR radar gun, hooked up to 110v house power adapter, mounted in a tree at windshield height to the road. Was pointed down the road to the main test course road.
Radar gun was 90 degrees off axis, on a side road, about 50 meters from the intersection.
Very heavy foliage everywhere but the road surfaces.
This is a hardcore off axis foliage heavy course. Ranges greatly reduced.
Gun was never touched after initial setup.
There was light traffic on the main road. I’m not discounting scores affected by traffic but multiple runs taken.

Purpose of Test Today:
Mostly to check out firmware differences on the R7, to see if there are major changes from older to the most recent firmwares in detection distances.
Also to test run course for a complete 3 band Ka test at the same location.
Bonus was that I cut out any Ka today, so I added in the V1G2 and R360c to compare against.

The Course:
Flat straight road, 80 kph limit, gun off on side road back about 50 meters, 90 degrees off axis.
View attachment 186693


Detectors:
R7A: International Firmware 138, K filter on, TSF On Highway Mode, Quiet Ride at 30 kph for sanity when parking during test. K Narrow segmenting. Did some runs with MRCD on. Too time consuming to switch to USA firmware during a time limited field test.

R7B: Same settings as R7A, started out with firmware 129 loaded at home. Loaded firmware 137 in the field for comparison runs. Also some MRCD runs on 137.

V1G2: All Bogeys Mode. Ran out of weather to continue onto logic mode runs. Sweeps set up same frequencies as Uniden K Narrow. Used my custom frequencies setup for daily use. JBV1 was disabled for the test, used phone for RD Test app only.

Redline 360c: Highway mode, K Segments 1,2,3. TSR Off, MRCD Off. Ka 2,4,5,6,8 like all the other detectors. Turned on MRCD and TSR later, and one run on Auto before calling it too wet for fair results to continue.

All detectors had auto lockouts off, or their equivalent settings.

Results:
View attachment 186753
View attachment 186754
View attachment 186755


Videos:
Here is the playlist of every single run and moment I recorded on the action cam.
Dashcam not used other than auto recording my driving.
I even captured the firmware updating of R7B to 137 after 129 runs.



Logs:

View attachment 186700 View attachment 186701 View attachment 186702 View attachment 186703


Final Thoughts:

I'm shocked at some of the results.
Some I predicted correctly.
In the end, it's one test with a challenging low powered gun on a difficult course.
I can think of many situations this test applies to in real LEO encounters.
There are other tests I've done showing different results, but the pattern is similar enough here.
Obviously the type of radar used on K Band results in different outcomes, different by detector models too.
Some detectors do well against the Bushnell and Python II K, but not well against the Falcon HR, and sometimes the other way around.

R7A: The International Firmware 138 by @Mithheru owned everything on previous test at the same site, against the Python II K Band gun. Here, it fell to 10% behind the best performers. However it was consistent and showed ZERO degradation when testing with MRCD On! This is my favorite go to daily and distance driver. Outstanding on K Band and Ka, excellent filtering, and I dare say my quietest detector in my city. Other cities where lockouts are not done take time to make quiet, but still close to R360c level quiet in new areas. All while maintaining this great range on Highway Mode. I haven't run Advanced or City since getting the International firmwares. I used this detector as a baseline against the R7B, as the whole point of today was to check firmware differences and find out why my hot R7B has been edged out consistently over recent testing.

R7B: Well damn. Firmware 129 was the hot ticket today. I haven't got firmware 133 saved and Uniden has it hidden on the site. They have changed around their updates pages. Not all legacy firmwares are found.
As I suspected, R7 firmwares have been improving BSM filtering, but losing K Band range. 18.5% loss here F129 to F137, on exact same conditions and settings. Somewhat disheartening, still extreme range but now losing out to the Redline 360c, R7 Int138, and R3.
The oddest thing though, after updating and factory resetting (a pain in the field), the R7B 137 did better with MRCD On! Exactly the opposite of tests earlier this year. Memory serves me that it was against this same Falcon HR at a different site. Something I can only speculate about, like a better firmware flash and reset, or a different 137 file. I used the latest 137 off the site, not off my files from earlier. A decent showing, but from best to 3rd place with the newest firmware.

R360c: Dead heat with our winner. Scored the two longest runs by a margin. Suffered from some consistency throughout. It does well by winning or nearly winning against every K Band gun I have (3). Very good BSM filtering too. To clip the Redline wings, turn on TSR and MRCD. Ouch, I didn't expect that. Worse than any Uniden penalty for doing the same. In fact, I run TSF every day and every test for the Unidens, to see real life results as to how I use them. Good thing I don't need TSR on the Redline. MRCD is very prone to falses, 20 times that of the R7. So 2 big strikes against it if you need those features and face the Falcon HR. You'll lose that class leading range by a good deal. First (tie) to 3rd, looking a long way to second.

V1G2: Well, I'm going to post this, jump into my flame retardant pajamas and hit the sack.
V1G2 did horrible in this test. This was by far the most disappointing result I've seen out of this detector, or posted by anyone else. It was dismal, Max 360c-ish performance against off axis foliage.
JBV1 was disabled before arriving at site. All-Bogeys was used. No different settings than my last test where against the Python II K it was well behind the R7s, but smoked the Max 360c. Today it absolutely hated the Falcon HR.
All I can say is more testing is required, in more situations. I'm looking for some Ka redemption in the follow up test to this one, repeating the process seen here.
I was about to run the V1G2 some more but weather shut me down.
I am more nervous than ever about running logic modes seeing this. Our RCMP use the Raptors/Falcon HR combo here, though 34.7 Stalker is the 10 to 1 favorite. Driving to the next town south K Band I/O becomes much more prevalent. Dangerously so.
On a positive note, I was running both the Redline 360c and V1G2 together for a short time on the last hour of my vacation. V1G2 alerted within 1 second of the R360, at a newly place speed sign in a known speed trap location. I note this as the sign was 24.120 frequency, very close to this Falcon HR used today. Different devices sure, but the V1G2 isn't dead, just not it's day today.


So what will I run in K Band danger zones?
R7A International 138, for it's consistent performance regardless of settings, and it's great filtering, plus my comfort and trust with it.
I won't be back dating the R7B to 133 or 129. Filtering performance there is subpar to my expectations now I've had time with better.
Firmware 137 is passable, but I might choose the R3 first because it still rocks at the top. F137 also has been up and down in testing, never a fail but more inconsistent than what pleases me.
So I guess my second choice would be the Redline 360c, despite the nerve racking I/O delay time. Waiting up to 2 seconds for it to sound the alarm against an I/O LEO is ridiculous. But monster range also makes up for a great deal too. I ran it all holidays long, BSMs were great, and Auto mode was easy as pie to use when in towns and cities the detector has never seen before. The grocery store door openers didn't trigger an Auto mode alert until I was right in front of them in the lot. The speed sensitive reduction does work, and at current firmware it has adequate city level sensitivity at city speeds. Damn that delay though, my hand would be twitching for the R3 instead, LOL.
V1G2 is really eating me up. I've posted threads about my woes trying to get BSM and door openers and Ka falses under control. Progress has slowly been coming, and more to look at yet.
But this test now guts me hard. Falcon HR and brother Raptor are real threats to me. I'm losing sleep over this now...

Anyways, enough for now. Off to bed without any supper.
Ho DC Fluid.
Thanks a lot for your test and for your time spent to obtain these results .

I'm interested to this test because of in France we have K band radars, Mesta Fusion and Gatso RT2.
So I must let K band on.
I set KA band of because of we don’t have KA band radars.
I let MRCD/T band on and for sure Gatso on.
No TSR settings available for 360C international instead.
I let MRCD/T on because I need to pick-up Gatso Radars (RT2) as soon as possible (they are installed beside the bumper of ordinary unmarked cars).
I wish to have the best results to Mesta Fusion too.
Now you discovered that if you set MRCD/T on, K band range fall on 360C.
What's your opinion on that?
MRCD/T on require RD to scan another band reacting on K band radar later and shorting the alert range?
Do you think I should set MRCD/T off being reassured that I will still have good results on Gatso and Mesta fusion ?
 

DC Fluid

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Now you discovered that if you set MRCD/T on, K band range fall on 360C.
What's your opinion on that?
MRCD/T on require RD to scan another band reacting on K band radar later and shorting the alert range?
Do you think I should set MRCD/T off being reassured that I will still have good results on Gatso and Mesta fusion ?
So be careful reading into this too much.
I turned both TSR & MRCD on at the same time as I was time limited on test runs. I did not turn on MRCT or any other additional radars.
I wanted to see what happened to R360 range vs. R7 because we've seen reductions the R7 with TSF and MRCD on. I always have TSF on in my area, I would turn it off in Gatso and MRCD areas.
So I don't know if it was TSR, MRCD or the combination of the two.
My advice is to turn on what you need for protection and don't add more just to see what it picks up.
 

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Vortex

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Sorry for being late to the party, haha. :D Great work with this test! I loved the little details like swapping firmwares mid-test like that, as well as your presentation with the color-matched bar charts that sit right next to the data charts. That's a great idea.

Watching a few of your test passes, I like that you had some convenient turn-around spots, plus good visibility to see oncoming traffic while you turn.

Results-wise, good to see some data on the R7 losing K band range as they've worked on their BSM filtering. I still gotta get around to playing with 1.38 Int. So many detectors, and so little time! :p

and the V1, sorry there bub. Watching some of the test clips and seeing how late it went off before the turn, that was shorter than I realized.

I feel for you guys with the Falcon HR and Raptor RP-1.
 

Deacon

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I am more nervous than ever about running logic modes seeing this.
Don’t be. There’s zero difference between A and Little L other than the Little L initially alerts at whatever muted volume is, like the Gen1, which gives time for V1Driver or JBV1 to decide whether to keep it muted. Otherwise in A mode it’s the same alert for better or worse at full volume. It’s Big L where things get interesting as the Gen2 tries to really keep it quiet if it can, but then punch-throughs alert at full volume—and quite likely at high alert levels like you just got hit by I/O and might stain your upholstery. It’s hard to have it all. Come on, Theia, I want you in my hands.
 

DC Fluid

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Don’t be. There’s zero difference between A and Little L other than the Little L initially alerts at whatever muted volume is, like the Gen1, which gives time for V1Driver or JBV1 to decide whether to keep it muted. Otherwise in A mode it’s the same alert for better or worse at full volume. It’s Big L where things get interesting as the Gen2 tries to really keep it quiet if it can, but then punch-throughs alert at full volume—and quite likely at high alert levels like you just got hit by I/O and might stain your upholstery. It’s hard to have it all. Come on, Theia, I want you in my hands.
That's my issue is I get no alerts on little L as I have muted volume at zero, and on motorcycle only ever hear JBV1 alerts.
The visual isn't enough alert for me, so I have to be aware that when on little L I'm at reduced warning range.
The more and more I add to filtering levels/frequency ranges, the less early warning I get.
Extremely quiet vs. early warning.
You're right, hard to have it all.
Seeking balance....
Post automatically merged:

Watching a few of your test passes, I like that you had some convenient turn-around spots, plus good visibility to see oncoming traffic while you turn.
A serious consideration when driving a long box super crew tuned gas guzzler.
Minimum mileage and access.
God I wish the situation this year allowed motorcycle testing again. 1/3 or less the cost, but a leaner operation for equipment.
 
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Deacon

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That's my issue is I get no alerts on little L as I have muted volume at zero, and on motorcycle only ever hear JBV1 alerts.
Oh, I have no idea how you have JBV1 set up, but if you’re getting alert audio from JBV1 it doesn’t matter what your muted volume is on the Gen2 or running A vs Little L when you can’t hear the detector itself alerting either way. It only depends on what JBV1 is set up to alert you to (helmet audio I presume).
 

DC Fluid

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Oh, I have no idea how you have JBV1 set up, but if you’re getting alert audio from JBV1 it doesn’t matter what your muted volume is on the Gen2 or running A vs Little L when you can’t hear the detector itself alerting either way. It only depends on what JBV1 is set up to alert you to (helmet audio I presume).
Yeah, primary concern is V1G2 BT alerts into helmet Sena speakers via JBV1.
That part is flawless.
Balancing out alerts with the garbage I've seen here with adequate K Band coverage for Raptors and Falcons is tricky.
I'm glad I've not encountered 24.150 guns locally, just the 24.125 centered ones. (Thanks again Mazda CX-5 for complicating that too).
It's a more difficult balance when jumping into my truck and having V1 beeps sound out that I didn't hear on the motorcycle.
I don't fully trust the phone and definitely don't trust the Ford Sync 3 system to be 100% reliably alerting, so I prefer a stand alone detector alert to supplement the JBV1, which is phone speaker only. Even with JBV1 the punch throughs or preliminary alerts sound out at main volume in the truck, where I didn't hear them on the bike. Solution is to mute all volumes on V1G2 and go with just phone sounds. I'm not able to get there yet.

I've made steady progress to one setting fits all and need more time in the seat to re-evaluate the changes.
I would say 75% better than my last meltdown over trying to get the V1G2 quiet.
Having zero hands on experience with V1 or JBV1 until lately has been a steep learning curve.
A big part of thing is understanding the different terminology used and what they actually do when chosen.
Like most things, there is no industry standard terminology for similar functions.
Even the wifes new Subaru has Subaru catch phrases for all the IVT systems so try searching for the lane assist, collision avoidance, BSM, etc by what we commonly call it, good luck. Subaru 101 before able to barely function in the cockpit. LOL.
 

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