Why Theia at a price point of $1000+ is not cost effective.

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All the weak points in German cars fail after warranty runs out. That’s all I know and I’m sticking to it. They also engineer shit so when you have to replace an item that’s an expected failure point, they bury that shit under so much crap, the labor alone is 3-4 times what it should be. Don’t buy German if you don’t like doing your own work on the car.... or just keep leasing and turning it back in.

And you base this on what, the last 15 German cars you have owned and kept for over 10 years each????

Go to the track sometime and look what the guys that don't have big sponsors are campaigning with, that's right, it is a Porsche!

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SwankPeRFection

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And you base this on what, the last 15 German cars you have owned and kept for over 10 years each????

Go to the track sometime and look what the guys that don't have big sponsors are campaigning with, that's right, it is a Porsche!

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Do you live in a world where Porsche isn’t the ONLY German car brand? I know I do. Porsche has their own failure points, but you’d have to be silly to not think some things could be engineered better so they don’t constantly fail. Crank pulleys that separate, plastic thermostats that internally snap and engine mounts that aren’t rated for stock power levels, let alone anything above that. And that’s just naming a few in the Audi line. Even the RS and R models have the same failure points and those are made to see some track use. It’s just bad engineering they don’t want to fix because it’s what I call “calculated bad engineering”. They want their dealerships to have these things to work on where it’s low cost for the part and high cost for the labor. Some things are so badly designed, they’ll fail while in warranty... repetitively. You’d think they’d catch on... the tuner aftermarket has. 🙄
 

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Do you live in a world where Porsche isn’t the ONLY German car brand? I know I do. Porsche has their own failure points, but you’d have to be silly to not think some things could be engineered better so they don’t constantly fail. Crank pulleys that separate, plastic thermostats that internally snap and engine mounts that aren’t rated for stock power levels, let alone anything above that. And that’s just naming a few in the Audi line. Even the RS and R models have the same failure points and those are made to see some track use. It’s just bad engineering they don’t want to fix because it’s what I call “calculated bad engineering”. They want their dealerships to have these things to work on where it’s low cost for the part and high cost for the labor. Some things are so badly designed, they’ll fail while in warranty... repetitively. You’d think they’d catch on... the tuner aftermarket has. 🙄

Again, you are full of assumptions! Porsche was an example plus a direct contradiction to your silly notion by just looking at any road course track on any given weekend! I have owned a 914/6 as well as raced it. I owned and raced an Audi Quatro. I have owned and raced a BMW 2002 Rally Car. I have had a 944 Turbo, VW GTI, Jetta GLI, a Corrado, and there is a SCCA spec VW 16V Scirocco currently sitting in my driveway. The GTI had over 225K on it when I sold it and all I ever replaced on it were plugs, tires, brakes, fluids, the front CV joints once to upgrade them when the time came, same for the struts as I went to Bilstein race setup. The other vehicles all had over 150K on them when sold and NONE of them ever had a problem. Tires, brakes, plugs, fluids, and a battery here or there was they ever needed. Other than the miracle 2003 Ford Expedition I currently own, all the German cars I ever owned needed the least attention! My Saleen Mustang wasn't to bad for a vehicle always driven to its limit except for eating pads and rotors, starters, and batteries.

It appears your mileage has varied, but even so, hard to broad brush all German vehicles from that is it not?

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SwankPeRFection

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Again, you are full of assumptions! Porsche was an example plus a direct contradiction to your silly notion by just looking at any road course track on any given weekend! I have owned a 914/6 as well as raced it. I owned and raced an Audi Quatro. I have owned and raced a BMW 2002 Rally Car. I have had a 944 Turbo, VW GTI, Jetta GLI, a Corrado, and there is a SCCA spec VW 16V Scirocco currently sitting in my driveway. The GTI had over 225K on it when I sold it and all I ever replaced on it were plugs, tires, brakes, fluids, the front CV joints once to upgrade them when the time came, same for the struts as I went to Bilstein race setup. The other vehicles all had over 150K on them when sold and NONE of them ever had a problem. Tires, brakes, plugs, fluids, and a battery here or there was they ever needed. Other than the miracle 2003 Ford Expedition I currently own, all the German cars I ever owned needed the least attention! My Saleen Mustang wasn't to bad for a vehicle always driven to its limit except for eating pads and rotors, starters, and batteries.

It appears your mileage has varied, but even so, hard to broad brush all German vehicles from that is it not?

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I think the year of vehicles is something you need to consider here because if yours were from the days when nobody bitched and moaned over their Starbucks coffee having a slight ripple affect in them due to engine vibration, you would have had good old solid mounts and not fluid filled void crap to make sure you’re all super comfy. Again, most of what you listed are older cars from an era where things were a bit more durable. Find someone with a newer BMW straight six who’s got oil leaks and other issues or pretty much any Audi post 2006 (even the 2.0L) and it’ll have mounts or other small/known issues that seem to go out after a couple of years of age on them. The more comfort and plastics they decided to implement into the drivetrain (suspension included), the more problems they developed. Even slightly older models of luxury Merc and Audi sedans that had air suspension. I challenge you to find one that’s not had issues with it. Like I said, what you picked and have experience with was solid, just like what I’ve picked and have experience with have had some issues. That said, for me, all the problems were expected and were fixed with aftermarket parts that no longer will be a problem in those areas. Fix once and done. Still annoying though when I see others run into the same issues because the manufacturer simply won’t address it, even though they keep releasing different revisions of said parts that are supposedly “stronger” but really aren’t. ✌️
 

WildOne

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I think the year of vehicles is something you need to consider here because if yours were from the days when nobody bitched and moaned over their Starbucks coffee having a slight ripple affect in them due to engine vibration, you would have had good old solid mounts and not fluid filled void crap to make sure you’re all super comfy.
You may have something here. My wife's volvo has a rubber bushing everywhere you look. They even have rubber isolating rubber! One car has the alternator, power steering pump and AC pump mounted with rubber bushings. It's all very quiet until it isn't. After a few years they are all going bad...one at a time. One of the cars we replace engine mounts/bushings every 3 years it seems. My 25 year old truck with 450K still has the same engine mounts and 1 new transmission mount! I've only replaced my 50 year old vette engine mounts twice...and I used to race it. They went out due to HP, not age.
 

SwankPeRFection

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You may have something here. My wife's volvo has a rubber bushing everywhere you look. They even have rubber isolating rubber! One car has the alternator, power steering pump and AC pump mounted with rubber bushings. It's all very quiet until it isn't. After a few years they are all going bad...one at a time. One of the cars we replace engine mounts/bushings every 3 years it seems. My 25 year old truck with 450K still has the same engine mounts and 1 new transmission mount! I've only replaced my 50 year old vette engine mounts twice...and I used to race it. They went out due to HP, not age.
Yep... just like 2000 year series Subarus had aluminum intake plenums and newer ones are plastic. There’s a place for phenolic plastics to be used and be fine and then there’s not. Unfortunately, when price vs profitability comes into play, that divider gets blurred badly. Ironically, the money saved by making things out of plastics doesn’t get passed onto the consumer as a savings on said vehicles. If anything, the consumer ends up paying more to fix it when it does break out of warranty.
 

Makemeasammich

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We already know what the price of Theia is going to be...Best Buy slipped. It was $899 on their webpage for a few hours. Of course, Jon or Randy came on here and said that wasn't the real price and that it was just a "place holder" on Best Buy's website. Riiiiiiight. Best Buy doesn't do "place holders" with made up prices. Not an hour after they posted, the product was taken down on Best Buy's site. So regardless of what Radenso tells you, remember they said it would be out in 2020 even though they knew for weeks (months?) that it wasn't going to make the deadline. The cost of Theia $900. Discuss...
 

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Jon at Radenso

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We already know what the price of Theia is going to be...Best Buy slipped. It was $899 on their webpage for a few hours. Of course, Jon or Randy came on here and said that wasn't the real price and that it was just a "place holder" on Best Buy's website. Riiiiiiight. Best Buy doesn't do "place holders" with made up prices. Not an hour after they posted, the product was taken down on Best Buy's site. So regardless of what Radenso tells you, remember they said it would be out in 2020 even though they knew for weeks (months?) that it wasn't going to make the deadline. The cost of Theia $900. Discuss...

Quoting for future lulz
 

Jon at Radenso

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Post automatically merged:

We'll see bro

Lol do you think arguing about pricing with the guy that can unilaterally change the price is a winning proposition?
 

Boozehound

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Lol do you think arguing about pricing with the guy that can unilaterally change the price is a winning proposition?
There's that. $900 would make it the most expensive WS RD. This could be a tough sell with R360c being only $800 with tax aaaaand coming with the legendary EscortLive.
 

Makemeasammich

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Do you think misleading your clientele any lying to them about release, is a winning proposition?

And oh please, you aren't changing anything. Go ahead, add $50 and price it at $949. Watch your sales plummet. Or go ahead and subtract $50 and price it at $850. That would be smarter, but won't happen.

Best Buy had product listed with price. It was caught. You noticed. Best Buy takes down page within minutes. Yeah, total mistake. Placeholder. Stop lying about stuff. You think Escort really gives a crud what you price it at? You give yourself too much credit for thinking you are going to crush them in marketshare. You're like the coach of the Jacksonville Jaguars, withholding information about what QB you're going to start against Kansas City. KC doesn't care. Escort and Uniden don't care either. Just stop lying and try to act professional.
 

jestric

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There's that. $900 would make it the most expensive WS RD. This could be a tough sell with R360c being only $800 with tax aaaaand coming with the legendary EscortLive.

Don’t forget about JBTheia1. EL won’t know what hit it. 😉
 
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Boozehound

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We need a Troll Radenso thread. There we can post all baseless accusations, ad hominem attacks, and vicious rumors. It'll be easier to find that sort of content and stop the hijacking of other threads.
 

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