Dodgy van K band detection and frequencies in NZ - Observations and developments

Mithheru

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@dudeinnz @DEMON5 @Zakk @Cosworthnz @FocusedWest @At0mic9 ....

Mobile redflex detection - Hmm, the plot thickens...

I'm having various reports from around Auckland of the DFR9forNZ missing some vans.

I thought I may have solved the DFR9 issue, because I perhaps overcooked it to scan too low in the latest DFR9forNZ release with segmentation. But based upon the latest reports, I'm not now so convinced.

Interestingly, I have had two reports of a white redflex VW van LRZ135 being tested with different detectors by different people. This was not being detected by the updated DFR9forNZ.

Funnily enough, someone had blulink update their US imported R3 to a more recent (seemingly also not released)150 R3 NZ firmware. They also saw the very same white VW van LRZ135 in Auckland. What is perhaps not so surprising is that their R3 also gave no alert to this same van.

For the R3 we generally know this hardware limited on K band and cannot scan below 24.05. I myself have been lucky enough to test the very latest Official Uniden US R3 firmware 154.215.115 (as yet unreleased). Against my variable K source I was hoping by some miracle this might have fixed the low scanning K band issue. But not so.

So taken together the testing against LRZ135 is actually a really interesting development. The DFR9forNZ I am confident can detect K band down to 23.94 and up to somewhere between 24.14-24.20. The blulink updated R3 I am confident has no ability to scan below 24.05 since it is a rebranded 150 US firmware, but would go right up to 24.25.

Therefore, between these tests it seems we either have a dummy redflex van (seems unlikely), or else one that scans right down ultra low on K band between 23.90-23.94 or perhaps even lower!?

Therefore anyone with an R7 in Auckland, it'd be really interesting to see reports of K band detection from this same white VW van.

Also with the release of the 128 International R7 firmware, it makes sense to know what vans are where, and what their approximate frequencies are. This would allow people to more accurately choose the right segmentation without pulling in an excessive amount of noise. This would be particularly useful for people that just buy a new detector and mostly drive locally, or else when people are on holiday in a part of NZ they are not so familiar with.

I'm going to file an OIA request with NZ Police to see if I can get detailed information on the calibration data for each mobile redflex camera, and photo proof of enforcement for each van.

To date, my list is quite short. So far from my list we have:

HTF443 Red Hyundai: - Wellington (K band ~24.02 - Detection confirmed on DFR9forNZ and R7)
LRZ139 Silver VW Van - Wellington (K Band 24.036 - Detection confirmed on DFR9forNZ and R7)
??? Blue Hyundai - Wellington (K Band ~24.02?? - Detection confirmed on DFR9forNZ and R7)

KZZ504. Blue VW Van Palmerston Nth (~24.10-24.11 Detection confirmed on DFR9forNZ)

LRZ135 White VW Van - Auckland (??? Unknown/undetectable??)
LAV 859 Dark Blue VW Van - Auckland (K Band 24.008 - Detection confirmed on R7 )

?? Colour / Make ??? - Te Puna near Tauranga (K Band 24.016 - Detection confirmed on R7 @KiwiClaire )
?? Dark blue Merc - Glenfield (Auckland) (K band ??? - Detection confirmed on R7 @porkchop )
 
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LouG

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I'll try and remember the ones I see. But they are rare, only one so far in Tauranga.
I have seen vans that aren't transmitting though, not sure why, they don't have to save film stock like the old analogue systems.
 

porkchop

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I was going up Onewa Rd in Auckland last weekend and the R7 detected a van on 26.042 or 24.062- (one or the other since I didnt write it down!) but it gave me a lot of warning, ramped up and the arrows pointed the right way going past. Mercedes van dark blue.
 

Mithheru

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I'll try and remember the ones I see. But they are rare, only one so far in Tauranga.
I have seen vans that aren't transmitting though, not sure why, they don't have to save film stock like the old analogue systems.
@ARW not quite sure why you were having trouble posting. But I'll reproduce the essence of what you said here:


"I have been back on my regular trips from the Bay of Islands to Auckland and back. After having passed at least 4 or 5 RedFlex vans with absolutely no detection whatsoever, I finally had a hit just north of the Marsden Point roundabout. The van was parked facing south (I was heading north) and the DFR9 went nuts about 50m before I drew level with the van and continued until I was 150m passed the van (rear detection). I turned around further up the road and the detector went off about 150-200m from the van. Frequency was 24.09.

I can only deduce that vans have been parking on the side of the road but not operational.
"


I also passed the red Hyundai van in Wellington the other day running the R7 and got no alert. I thought this was quite odd, and perhaps they'd either retuned or perhaps just setting up or packing up. As I was on the way somewhere and the location on the motorway was a bit tricky, I didn't get chance to turn around and set the R7 full wide to recheck. However, saw the same van again a week later and detected it without trouble. It's a puzzle.

Sometimes, perhaps they do just park them on the side of the road to make people slow down. Perhaps the NZ police will start using cardboard cut outs next!?
 

At0mic9

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@ARW not quite sure why you were having trouble posting. But I'll reproduce the essence of what you said here:


"I have been back on my regular trips from the Bay of Islands to Auckland and back. After having passed at least 4 or 5 RedFlex vans with absolutely no detection whatsoever, I finally had a hit just north of the Marsden Point roundabout. The van was parked facing south (I was heading north) and the DFR9 went nuts about 50m before I drew level with the van and continued until I was 150m passed the van (rear detection). I turned around further up the road and the detector went off about 150-200m from the van. Frequency was 24.09.

I can only deduce that vans have been parking on the side of the road but not operational.
"


I also passed the red Hyundai van in Wellington the other day running the R7 and got no alert. I thought this was quite odd, and perhaps they'd either retuned or perhaps just setting up or packing up. As I was on the way somewhere and the location on the motorway was a bit tricky, I didn't get chance to turn around and set the R7 full wide to recheck. However, saw the same van again a week later and detected it without trouble. It's a puzzle.

Sometimes, perhaps they do just park them on the side of the road to make people slow down. Perhaps the NZ police will start using cardboard cut outs next!?
I have passed a dark blue VW van and detected at 24.008Ghz - real world video here - https://www.rdforum.org/threads/104187/
I passed a white VW van near the motorway leading onto the Harbour Bridge, from vague memory it was 24.010khz but will make a note of it when i pass it next time
Post automatically merged:

these are K band Redflex hits i have recorded so far
Auckland:
24.008
24.003
24.030
24.010
 
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At0mic9

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I'll try and remember the ones I see. But they are rare, only one so far in Tauranga.
I have seen vans that aren't transmitting though, not sure why, they don't have to save film stock like the old analogue systems.
for the fixed pole cameras have a router inside, connected to WAN via fibre or 4G cellular, and upload digital pics in real time, they have no local hard drive or storage, everything is uploaded to the cloud. If the network connection is offline, you wont get a ticket.
 

Mithheru

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@dudeinnz is it possible to continuously update the first post on the thread so I can keep adding in the van reports?
 

dudeinnz

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@dudeinnz is it possible to continuously update the first post on the thread so I can keep adding in the van reports?
If you are unable to, feel free to PM me and I can edit your OP for you. The edit function has a time-out feature.

Also, wrt to no alert, I have had this occur once or twice. In my opinion it is either they have just parked there and are setting up/waiting for the person who operates it, or the opposite, they have wrapped up for the day, and the van is parked there waiting for pick up.
 
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LouG

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for the fixed pole cameras have a router inside, connected to WAN via fibre or 4G cellular, and upload digital pics in real time, they have no local hard drive or storage, everything is uploaded to the cloud. If the network connection is offline, you wont get a ticket.
So a wifi or cellular blocker could stuff it right up?
 

philnz

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Before I moved north and traveled auckland wide i regularly had vans with no signal hit and then on way back would get a signal.
Sometimes i think they just sit there.
Thanks mithheru for your work and look forward to the OIA reuslts
 

DAF

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??? Blue Hyundai - Wellington (K Band ~24.02?? - Detection confirmed on DFR9forNZ and R7)
I have had several hits on this one lately and was getting ~24.04 and ~24.041
I'll dig out the footage, got 3 vans in one day recently
 

Mithheru

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I have had several hits on this one lately and was getting ~24.04 and ~24.041
I'll dig out the footage, got 3 vans in one day recently
Yes please let me know. I'm going to try to file my next OIA request this week. It'll take them a while to get a reply, so all the info we can gather would still be most useful. There is no guarantee they'll tell me everything I want to know, but last time I was very surprised with the amount of useful and detailed info I got about all the fixed redlight and speed cameras.
 

Mithheru

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@Zakk @DEMON5 @At0mic9 @dudeinnz @Jakesey Managed to find the new redflex van in Wellington. This is a green VW Van detecting at 24.033.

It was also in a great location so managed to do a bit more comparison of US R7 133, R7 128 Int and DFR9forNZ.

I'll try to get the video compiled in a day or so. I also did a lot of stationary testing and comparing vertical and horizontal mount. Still not seeing any improvement to sensitivity on 133, and DFR9forNZ is still holding up very well with the R7 in this testing.
 

At0mic9

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@Zakk @DEMON5 @At0mic9 @dudeinnz @Jakesey Managed to find the new redflex van in Wellington. This is a green VW Van detecting at 24.033.

It was also in a great location so managed to do a bit more comparison of US R7 133, R7 128 Int and DFR9forNZ.

I'll try to get the video compiled in a day or so. I also did a lot of stationary testing and comparing vertical and horizontal mount. Still not seeing any improvement to sensitivity on 133, and DFR9forNZ is still holding up very well with the R7 in this testing.
will be very interested in the results, especially the vertical vs horizontal mount testing
 

Mithheru

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FInally compiled the footage:

 

At0mic9

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FInally compiled the footage:

awesome testing against the Redflex! interesting to see that the K band vertical mount gave more range, 4 bars, as opposed to 2 bars when horizontally mounted. funny seeing a Ka band hit, when your testing for K band, and good to see Leo's trying a diversified revenue stream! ;-)
 

KiwiClaire

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@Mithheru '?? Colour / Make ??? - Te Puna near Tauranga (K Band 24.016 - Detection confirmed on R7 @KiwiClaire )"

  • This was dark blue VW van (sorry about the lack of details in that post.
  • I've since seen another on Vaughan Road in Rotorua (just outside of my workplace) this time a dark green VW van on 24.010. I'm pretty sure it was the same van on Old Quarry road maybe a week later in Fairy Springs.

Back to Vaughn road, I've so far seen a camera at least 4 or 5 times, patrol cars either moving or parked running Ka dozens of times. And for the first time, maybe 3 or 4 cops in two groups, with no patrol car in sight using a hand held Ka radar while hiding in trees on the side of Vaughan Rd. The first pair would do the radaring and likely radio communicate with the second group just up the road which would presumably wave down the offender. I saw one driver pulled over on the way past, and I got the full treatment with pointed at me with a range down to approx. 10m (they turned and kept the radar gun directed straight at me as I drove past like it was laser tag or something lol - I had a good chuckle. I think that guy may have needed a bit extra training outlining the cosine rule and radar fundamentals. Rotorua's finest fo' so'. ;)

If you need to test your countermeasures (except for laser), come to Rotorua, particularly Vaughan Road! Good to see if your R7 can detect Ka at less that 20m lol..
 

Zakk

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@Mithheru saw this video from Jon at Radenso on radar signal attenuation with different materials as well as vertical vs horizontal signals. Right at the end he shows that glass attenuates by about 2-2.5db (and plastic is pretty much zero). Like vertical mounting every little bit helps against a low powered Redflex signal, so that would also be increasing range with my remote vertical plastic box R7 setup. Might be useful Redflex info to others here.
 
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LouG

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@Mithheru '?? Colour / Make ??? - Te Puna near Tauranga (K Band 24.016 - Detection confirmed on R7 @KiwiClaire )"

  • This was dark blue VW van (sorry about the lack of details in that post.
  • I've since seen another on Vaughan Road in Rotorua (just outside of my workplace) this time a dark green VW van on 24.010. I'm pretty sure it was the same van on Old Quarry road maybe a week later in Fairy Springs.

Back to Vaughn road, I've so far seen a camera at least 4 or 5 times, patrol cars either moving or parked running Ka dozens of times. And for the first time, maybe 3 or 4 cops in two groups, with no patrol car in sight using a hand held Ka radar while hiding in trees on the side of Vaughan Rd. The first pair would do the radaring and likely radio communicate with the second group just up the road which would presumably wave down the offender. I saw one driver pulled over on the way past, and I got the full treatment with pointed at me with a range down to approx. 10m (they turned and kept the radar gun directed straight at me as I drove past like it was laser tag or something lol - I had a good chuckle. I think that guy may have needed a bit extra training outlining the cosine rule and radar fundamentals. Rotorua's finest fo' so'. ;)

If you need to test your countermeasures (except for laser), come to Rotorua, particularly Vaughan Road! Good to see if your R7 can detect Ka at less that 20m lol..
A handheld Ka gun? Are you positive? Or were you getting Ka from the cars not the gun. Perhaps the gun was Lidar and too close for your R7 to see the beam?
The reason I ask is that the last two OIA info sheets did not list Ka guns. there was something called a Stalker Acura, but whatever that is, it's not on the Stalker product list.
 

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