New Ka band false alerts oddities... Across more than one brand

DrHow

Going Plaid+ (Tesla S). RDT refugee
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Corgi Lovers
Advanced User
Joined
May 18, 2018
Messages
4,251
Reaction score
7,369
Recently have observed people talking, complaining about Ka falses on there device.

I have been experiencing this. Where my traditional segmenting (2,4,5,6,8) does not solve the problem.

I have have seen falsing across most of Ka bands.

I observe this behavior growing in past several months. Affects my VR G2s, R7, 360 platform (non RL). I have second hand user report of my Pro M triggering Ka more often then normal, no police observed.

There are reports on RDF of multiple RL 360c doing this (I do not own one yet).


At first I blamed theG2 new Ka falsing (my current heavy use device) new .019 firmware. The new firmware also has messed up the best in class BSM filtering (IMO, more on G2 BSM in another post later). Then, as I moved between devices (and different vehicles), started to notice same issue.

The Ka false problem ratio is rare compared to time. But, the ratio seems to be getting worse.

As a user of CM for 40+ years, I know my way around how to read devices for situational awareness. Here is a sampling of experiences.

I run 4 and 6 segments due to wobbly 34.7 machines being off frequency. On G2 “33.8” freq area cannot be segmented (1,3), so it shows this range. Which is good in northern GA due to actual police running off frequency (outside seg 2). Actually seen be me and others (@benzr is one that comes to mind)

Ka falsing on 2,4,5,6 and lessor extent 8 (Maybe because 7, 9,10 are turned off).

The Ka false I have seen also hits right on 2,5,(Lesser degree 8). Adds to total count of the other frequencies acting up.

I am suggesting that we keep our eyebrows raised, and not assume all Ka alerts we would expect to see are not LEO. And log those that are not.

I have logged JBV1 data to sort through. I have Escort Live observations (need to take screen shots) of miles of Ka reports in a stretch. Sure, once in awhile this can happen due to someone following or being in front of some LEO blasting C/O that goes around bends, and over hills. We have all seen this. However recently when I have used EL, it is worse in busy traveled areas for this to show up.

I experience this both front and rear antenna. With rear antenna, it can go on for long stretches until I change direction. There is no LEO. I have pulled over, turned around to check. These false alerts can be on any segment I have turned on.

I have observed what I ”Guess” are causes of this. I posted pictures of ambulances and trucks on RDF in 2020 that were causing Ka falsing. Rare, but real. This past couple months semis, box trucks, and cars could he causing this. But, there is more to this Ka chaos, IMO.

I observe the Ka alert to shift frequencies. Mostly within (But not always) a segment range, say 34.xxx will show hopping around. On G2 it will show up with many tracked frequencies on JBV1. False many times will also trigger extra “bogie“ counts on the G2 display (Which sometimes kicks in the double beep, and it goes silent. Like a “junk filter” kicks in).

Roughly 80% of the experience is with the VR G2. Because I run it 80%+ of the time being mentioned.

What could this be? At same time multiple brands and devices are all saddled with bad FW, or have gone bad? Do not think so. All of a sudden millions of drivers have bought some new “Batman” like spewing RD that triggers my high end gear? Enough volume sold, I am running into them? Do not think so.

Is there some new tech that is now infiltrating traffic sensors, adaptive cruise controls, or something else? When the rare time this happens it is like the recent past years when we first came upon visual distance of a Pacifica or a Honda that blurted our BSM for half a mile. Only now all this is on Ka?

I have experience while driving multiple vehicles, with Wifi, no wifi, and never had this issue before. Also, in rental vehicles. This past Month or so I have been traveling extensive “pre China virus“ business miles driving. Shows up rare, but routine due to extensive shorter distance +long haul time behind the wheel. This past week, I grew frustrated at this phenomenon, to make this post.

I am posting this thread as a way to see, over time, if others are seeing this trend? Not specific to one brand. Please post your observations. Even if it might appear to be obscure, or someone might suggest you “missed something”. IF this is a real trend, let’s document observations so better testing can be done.

If this post gains any traction, I will go back and get some screen shots of the JBV1 logs.
 
Last edited:

PHILBERT

left lane, behind your [email protected]$$ ugly SUV_ MOVE OVER!
Intermediate User
Joined
Nov 20, 2018
Messages
563
Reaction score
1,297
Are we thinking Ka is now being used for BSM?

Phil
 

Kennyc56

Ford Lover-I/O hater!
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Feb 22, 2018
Messages
5,102
Reaction score
18,377
Location
I/O Hell, Aka Eastern N.C.
I'm seeing 35.600 and higher from my V1G2. That's because I run it wide open with no custom frequencies. Jane's 2 R1's in her ghetto arrow setup are segged to 2-5-8 and never get Ka falses. Same for my other R1/Redline-O ghetto setups. I've been running one of my Redline-O's beside the V1G2 for the last couple of weeks to help in case I get hit with some point blank I/O since the V1G2's I/O ramp needs work. I'm only running 5-8 on it, and it never has any Ka falses. I know what's causing my V1G2 to false. It's big trucks. It's happened enough that I finally figured it out! BTW, so far the V1G2 is beating the Redline-O against I/O, bad ramp and all!
 
Last edited:

DrHow

Going Plaid+ (Tesla S). RDT refugee
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Corgi Lovers
Advanced User
Joined
May 18, 2018
Messages
4,251
Reaction score
7,369
Are we thinking Ka is now being used for BSM?

Phil
Possible. Or for adaptive cruise. Or for some traffic sensors. Or some other IOT like purpose.
 

DrHow

Going Plaid+ (Tesla S). RDT refugee
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Corgi Lovers
Advanced User
Joined
May 18, 2018
Messages
4,251
Reaction score
7,369
I'm seeing 35.600 and higher from my V1G2. That's because I run it wide open with no custom frequencies. Jane's 2 R1's in her ghetto arrow setup are segged to 2-5-8 and never get Ka falses. Same for my other R1/Redline-O ghetto setups. I've been running one of my Redline-O's beside the V1G2 for the last couple of weeks to help in case I get hit with some point blank I/O since the V1G2's I/O ramp needs work. I'm only running 5-8 on it, and it never has any Ka falses. I know what's causing my V1G2 to false. It's big trucks. It's happened enough that I finally figured it out! BTW, so far the V1G2 is beating the Redline-O against I/O, bad ramp and all!
Yea, have seen false on 7,8,9 when running more than 8. And see 8 on its own too False. Lessor extent than in the 34 range.

Again, I thought falsely, that this is exclusive to .xx19 FW. Because I ran <=18 version non segmented very early in G2 game. Did not experience the Ka chaos seeing now. I think time, not a FW issue is the cause. More of this crap out there. Plus seeing this on other brands.
Post automatically merged:

All the more reason we need Theia to ID the signatures of these polluters, and filter them out. It's becoming an RF wasteland out there!

Phil
Yep... And then the new radar wars begin. Radar makers will change up their signatures, and other things that crowd sourcing or whatever will be needed for Radenso to keep up. Like the VPR wars with Dragon Eye, only worse.
 

PHILBERT

left lane, behind your [email protected]$$ ugly SUV_ MOVE OVER!
Intermediate User
Joined
Nov 20, 2018
Messages
563
Reaction score
1,297
Yea, have seen false on 7,8,9 when running more than 8. And see 8 on its own too False. Lessor extent than in the 34 range.

Again, I thought falsely, that this is exclusive to .xx19 FW. Because I ran <=18 version non segmented very early in G2 game. Did not experience the Ka chaos seeing now. I think time, not a FW issue is the cause. More of this crap out there. Plus seeing this on other brands.
Post automatically merged:


Yep... And then the new radar wars begin. Radar makers will change up their signatures, and other things that crowd sourcing or whatever will be needed for Radenso to keep up. Like the VPR wars with Dragon Eye, only worse.

That's possible, but may be negated by blacklisting the known garbage and allowing the known positive ID and unknown ID signals to pass through with the two distinct categories emphasised. And how many people will actually run Theia to make it worth the engineering and field maintenance effort?

Phil
 

Kennyc56

Ford Lover-I/O hater!
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Feb 22, 2018
Messages
5,102
Reaction score
18,377
Location
I/O Hell, Aka Eastern N.C.
Since I live in NC, I can still run 2-5-8 because they keep their guns pretty damn near spot on. If you drive up north however, you'll have to run a lot more segs and this problem will be much worse!
 

DrHow

Going Plaid+ (Tesla S). RDT refugee
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Corgi Lovers
Advanced User
Joined
May 18, 2018
Messages
4,251
Reaction score
7,369
Thanks guys for responding... Hitting the road in a few (Motorcycle ride). Will check back Later to see how others weighed in.
 

poolmon

Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Oct 26, 2013
Messages
1,256
Reaction score
2,458
Recently have observed people talking, complaining about Ka falses on there device.

I have have seen falsing across most of Ka bands.

I observe this behavior growing in past several months. Affects my VR G2s, R7, 360 platform (non RL). I have second hand user report of my Pro M triggering Ka more often then normal, no police observed.

There are reports on RDF of multiple RL 360c doing this (I do not own one yet).

I have recently noticed this on the 360c platform but attributed it to the recent update I did after holding it at v1.8 .
However, that update should not have affected Ka, so I am puzzled too.
 

OBeerWANKenobi

This is not the car you're looking for......
ModSec
VIP
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Corgi Lovers
Advanced User
Joined
Mar 20, 2018
Messages
7,857
Reaction score
23,919
Location
Outer Rim - Hiding from 35.5 I/O
The best way to really find out is recording the precise frequencies and dashcam video. Even with that, it's usually a chore to figure out new false sources but it's a much better chance.

My G2 is 2,4,5,6,8 and I haven't noticed any extra falsing yet
 

benzr

Been there done that !! Original V1 user !!
Advanced User
Joined
Apr 23, 2012
Messages
6,235
Reaction score
8,872
Location
FLA
All the more reason we need Theia to ID the signatures of these polluters, and filter them out. It's becoming an RF wasteland out there!

Phil
I HAVE TO AGREE WITH THIS ... AND YES YOU ARE ONTO SOMETHING. Much like when i identified K Band Low Power New units came into existence !!

Benzr
 

Too3zln

PSL +5
Premium Plus
Intermediate User
Joined
Jun 27, 2019
Messages
372
Reaction score
636
Location
Nebraska
The best way to really find out is recording the precise frequencies and dashcam video. Even with that, it's usually a chore to figure out new false sources but it's a much better chance.

My G2 is 2,4,5,6,8 and I haven't noticed any extra falsing yet
I wish I could afford a dashcam. I am saving for the next detector. I rarely get falses outside of 2/5/8 on my r1 so I haven't been Johnny on the spot on the others since they are so fleeting. I do have a few falses from satellite dishes, a traffic monitor, and a hardwired speed sign which I am sure is an old police unit. I can pick that one up at least a couple miles away. These falses all fall in the 5 range.
 
Last edited:

LouG

PSL +5
Intermediate User
Joined
Jan 2, 2014
Messages
5,043
Reaction score
7,798
Gen2 can now block 33.8 with CF's. It changed with 4.1019. I see less Ka falses on Gen2 than Gen1.
As for filtering Ka based on ID'ing Ka emitters, that treads a very dangerous line.
 

fitz4321

Running With Scissors
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Dec 12, 2015
Messages
2,481
Reaction score
4,769
Location
Bay Area, CA
There are two places I drive by that I get 34.7 in the same spot every time I pass now. One is near the toll plaza of a bridge and the other is a toll lane that hasn’t officially opened yet.
Both are recent, within the last couple of months.
 

SVG

PSL +5
VIP
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Intermediate User
Joined
Oct 1, 2017
Messages
544
Reaction score
840
Location
MT
I've been getting Ka falses up here in Montana. Not a ton but always Ka level 1. I'm running a new RC-M system so not sure what to make of it.
 

RadarScout

Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Advanced User
Joined
Sep 4, 2015
Messages
6,835
Reaction score
11,541
Location
Land of Crimson Tide!
Recently have observed people talking, complaining about Ka falses on there device.

I have been experiencing this. Where my traditional segmenting (2,4,5,6,8) does not solve the problem.

I have have seen falsing across most of Ka bands.

I observe this behavior growing in past several months. Affects my VR G2s, R7, 360 platform (non RL). I have second hand user report of my Pro M triggering Ka more often then normal, no police observed.

There are reports on RDF of multiple RL 360c doing this (I do not own one yet).


At first I blamed theG2 new Ka falsing (my current heavy use device) new .019 firmware. The new firmware also has messed up the best in class BSM filtering (IMO, more on G2 BSM in another post later). Then, as I moved between devices (and different vehicles), started to notice same issue.

The Ka false problem ratio is rare compared to time. But, the ratio seems to be getting worse.

As a user of CM for 40+ years, I know my way around how to read devices for situational awareness. Here is a sampling of experiences.

I run 4 and 6 segments due to wobbly 34.7 machines being off frequency. On G2 “33.8” freq area cannot be segmented (1,3), so it shows this range. Which is good in northern GA due to actual police running off frequency (outside seg 2). Actually seen be me and others (@benzr is one that comes to mind)

Ka falsing on 2,4,5,6 and lessor extent 8 (Maybe because 7, 9,10 are turned off).

The Ka false I have seen also hits right on 2,5,(Lesser degree 8). Adds to total count of the other frequencies acting up.

I am suggesting that we keep our eyebrows raised, and not assume all Ka alerts we would expect to see are not LEO. And log those that are not.

I have logged JBV1 data to sort through. I have Escort Live observations (need to take screen shots) of miles of Ka reports in a stretch. Sure, once in awhile this can happen due to someone following or being in front of some LEO blasting C/O that goes around bends, and over hills. We have all seen this. However recently when I have used EL, it is worse in busy traveled areas for this to show up.

I experience this both front and rear antenna. With rear antenna, it can go on for long stretches until I change direction. There is no LEO. I have pulled over, turned around to check. These false alerts can be on any segment I have turned on.

I have observed what I ”Guess” are causes of this. I posted pictures of ambulances and trucks on RDF in 2020 that were causing Ka falsing. Rare, but real. This past couple months semis, box trucks, and cars could he causing this. But, there is more to this Ka chaos, IMO.

I observe the Ka alert to shift frequencies. Mostly within (But not always) a segment range, say 34.xxx will show hopping around. On G2 it will show up with many tracked frequencies on JBV1. False many times will also trigger extra “bogie“ counts on the G2 display (Which sometimes kicks in the double beep, and it goes silent. Like a “junk filter” kicks in).

Roughly 80% of the experience is with the VR G2. Because I run it 80%+ of the time being mentioned.

What could this be? At same time multiple brands and devices are all saddled with bad FW, or have gone bad? Do not think so. All of a sudden millions of drivers have bought some new “Batman” like spewing RD that triggers my high end gear? Enough volume sold, I am running into them? Do not think so.

Is there some new tech that is now infiltrating traffic sensors, adaptive cruise controls, or something else? When the rare time this happens it is like the recent past years when we first came upon visual distance of a Pacifica or a Honda that blurted our BSM for half a mile. Only now all this is on Ka?

I have experience while driving multiple vehicles, with Wifi, no wifi, and never had this issue before. Also, in rental vehicles. This past Month or so I have been traveling extensive “pre China virus“ business miles driving. Shows up rare, but routine due to extensive shorter distance +long haul time behind the wheel. This past week, I grew frustrated at this phenomenon, to make this post.

I am posting this thread as a way to see, over time, if others are seeing this trend? Not specific to one brand. Please post your observations. Even if it might appear to be obscure, or someone might suggest you “missed something”. IF this is a real trend, let’s document observations so better testing can be done.

If this post gains any traction, I will go back and get some screen shots of the JBV1 logs.
I'll just go through the normal check list of trouble makers.
Satellite radio, cell phone in close proximity of detector, safety features of the vehicle, or a military base nearby.
I know it's frustrating trying to figure it out.
I've started getting a 34.68 detection around an Air Force base in a neighboring city. It's where the War College is that teaches high ranking officers of other nations strategies, (Noriega trained there). I've about decided it has something to do with perimeter monitoring to assist with the new iron fencing they put up.
 

NorEaster18

Maximum Efficiency
Advanced User
Joined
Sep 5, 2018
Messages
2,352
Reaction score
7,004
Location
The North Shore
Been reporting this for a while with my R3. Seems to be related to BSMs overdriving the detector, most often from Hondas. Almost always 34.83x or 34.84x for me, so always falling inside of Segment 6.



 

DrHow

Going Plaid+ (Tesla S). RDT refugee
Premium Plus
Lifetime Premium
Corgi Lovers
Advanced User
Joined
May 18, 2018
Messages
4,251
Reaction score
7,369
I'll just go through the normal check list of trouble makers.
Satellite radio, cell phone in close proximity of detector, safety features of the vehicle, or a military base nearby.
I know it's frustrating trying to figure it out.
I've started getting a 34.68 detection around an Air Force base in a neighboring city. It's where the War College is that teaches high ranking officers of other nations strategies, (Noriega trained there). I've about decided it has something to do with perimeter monitoring to assist with the new iron fencing they put up.
Agree on perimeter monitoring guess. Because at Louisville Airport, Air National guard facility (and other areas around the airport), the falsing on ocassion was K. Now it is all Ka.

And this was one of my points. Seems like some new Ka based fixed systems are cropping up. Plus what I am seeing with mobile emitters (Ambulances, semis, whatever).

If we see some more reports. I will go back, screen shot some of the JBV1 data and get shared (harder to do with the JBV1 only Android. Not connected to any method to get to Apple device, then moved here. Will try NFC).
Post automatically merged:

Been reporting this for a while with my R3. Seems to be related to BSMs overdriving the detector, most often from Hondas. Almost always 34.83x or 34.84x for me, so always falling inside of Segment 6.



Thanks. I think those were some of the ones I read. As mentioned at first, I saw patterns of other posts, recently now with RL 360c, and G2. I agree some of these are definitely in 4,5,6 range. I have seen this falsing right on top of 34.7x in seg 5. I too experience same thing regarding powerful signal from certain Honda, Semis, others. With arrow equipped devices, compounds the mess when around all this.

plus seeing it on other bands.

I do not want to make a mountain out of what now might be a mole hill. But... this recently seems to be getting worse.
 
Last edited:

Discord Server

Latest threads

Forum statistics

Threads
93,376
Messages
1,423,569
Members
23,799
Latest member
Jwr
Top