Question around first batch of Theia

NVR2FST

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Do you know what a preorder is?
I thought a pre-order was a way to lock in an order before a product was ready to ship. Didn't Valentine Research take credit cards before the V1 Gen 2 was ready and then notify people when they were in stock to inform them of the finalized price and ask if they wanted to go ahead and complete their order?
 

Randy at Radenso

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Maybe this has been asked and answered before, but why not have a "pre-order" option that would allow Radenso to keep a credit card and shipping address on file and then they could charge the card and ship the product as soon as units are available?
Maybe like 20 years ago you could do that but not now. It is a huge security risk. We don’t see any of your credit card information on our website, it goes straight to the processor to complete the transaction. Plus then we would get people upset when they get surprised their card is charged creating a entire headache. Trust me, we have a plan for everything. We will let everyone know at least a week ahead of time when pre-orders will begin. Everyone will pay the full amount to have their orders locked in.
 

Jon at Radenso

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So realistically the hardware has to be finalized and in production with a known cost already if it’s going to ship by the end of the year. It is understandable that the exact ship date may not be known due to import limitations but certainly pricing must be set - even without releasing competitive details Radenso could say if they are testing the final / candidate hardware model that would the community some confidence that there is progress. As for releasing details if they did release them it is not as if another company could use that knowledge to hurry and produce anything better especially if the new platform will be more software and AI driven unless there are problems there and they may not have confidence in making an end of year release. I guess what everyone wants is more transparency.
Here's the thing - just because we know something internally, it doesn't mean you are entitled to know it. By now, of course we know what MSRP will be barring some catastrophic event. Just like we know what our DSP strategy is, what stores it will be sold in, what countries it will launch in, what color it will be, what the case looks like, and what the RF architecture is. But there is zero incentive for us to release any of that and help our competitors prepare for when it is announced. You can already see that when we announced AI, the corporate drones at Escort told all of their dealers they have AI too going back to 2005. Everything we say or do directly drives the entire industry right now - to a shocking amount that I did not expect - so now that we're closer to release, I'd rather not give them time to plan a response in advance.

Just because we have shared 100x more than any other company has, it doesn't mean we have to share everything - especially when there is no benefit for us to do so. We will share what we wish to share when we wish to share it, which is far more than what any other company has done. Anyone who says the best isn't good enough was probably never really a Radenso customer in the first place, so who cares.
 
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RayC

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Here's the thing - just because we know something internally, it doesn't mean you are entitled to know it. By now, of course we know what MSRP will be barring some catastrophic event. Just like we know what our DSP strategy is, what stores it will be sold in, what countries it will launch in, what color it will be, what the case looks like, and what the RF architecture is. But there is zero incentive for us to release any of that and help our competitors prepare for when it is announced. You can already see that when we announced AI, the corporate drones at Escort told all of their dealers they have AI too going back to 2005. Everything we say or do directly drives the entire industry right now - to a shocking amount that I did not expect - so now that we're closer to release, I'd rather not give them time to plan a response in advance.

Just because we have shared 100x more than any other company has, it doesn't mean we have to share everything - especially when there is no benefit for us to do so. We will share what we wish to share when we wish to share it, which is far more than what any other company has done. Anyone who says the best isn't good enough was probably never really a Radenso customer in the first place, so who cares.
Since it seems like you know everything down to the price at this point (which would seem to indicate everything is known internally) what harm is there to have a likely release month? Is it still even on schedule for 2020 or is 2021 in play? Will there be external beta testers ahead of the full release adding more time? I can't see any of this particular information being of any advantage to competitors at this point. Valentine isn't going to release a Gen3 for at least a decade or three, escort just released their new flagship unit and Uniden released theirs around a year ago.

Excited to see how this unit performs as it's been talked about on the forums for what seems like a very long time. I will admit I do not keep up with the Radenso threads as much since the naming speculation was going about which may have been spring of this year. It is nice you are active on the forums.

I guess with the G2 in short supply and long wait times it may make sense to not put out a approximate date if it's still months out or even into next year. People may hold off on another purchase if they thing the next great thing is gonna be out sooner rather than later. On the other hand if the release date was sooner it would make business sense to let it be known so buyers will for sure hold off on a new purchase of a competitors product.

Anyway I hope it's sooner as all the hype has expectations pretty over the top for Theia. Also am hoping it's not any larger than the R7 in size. I know many months back something was mentioned about size but I would guess now you know since you know what the case will look like and I assume that means you know the dimensions. My apologies if you already made that known.
 

Jon at Radenso

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Since it seems like you know everything down to the price at this point (which would seem to indicate everything is known internally) what harm is there to have a likely release month? Is it still even on schedule for 2020 or is 2021 in play? Will there be external beta testers ahead of the full release adding more time? I can't see any of this particular information being of any advantage to competitors at this point. Valentine isn't going to release a Gen3 for at least a decade or three, escort just released their new flagship unit and Uniden released theirs around a year ago.
We've already answered these questions. 2020, test results will be posted by third parties before pre-orders. The reason you don't understand how this information could be of advantage to competitors is because you don't understand how the market works. If Escort knows our pricing and release date, they would instantly revamp sales incentives, pricing, back end incentive programs, and marketing in response. I guarantee you the R360C would not be priced as high as it is if Escort had known our price point; they shot themselves in the foot and that's exactly the point in keeping this information private. I know rdforum members think a ton of sales happen through manufacturer websites, but that's just not the case. The real war is won out in the retailers - who do not keep up with rdforum.

I guess with the G2 in short supply and long wait times it may make sense to not put out a approximate date if it's still months out or even into next year. People may hold off on another purchase if they thing the next great thing is gonna be out sooner rather than later. On the other hand if the release date was sooner it would make business sense to let it be known so buyers will for sure hold off on a new purchase of a competitors product.
Actually, .001% of the business is on these forums. Valentine isn't relevant to our business plan since he doesn't sell in any of the areas our main revenue streams are in (B&M, big-box, amazon, etc). It literally doesn't matter if he had the best detector in the world for $199; it would barely ding our revenue. Escort and Uniden are much bigger competitors due to the fact we share sales channels, whereas we do not with Valentine. But realistically, there is a good chance we sell out of the first batch of Theias regardless - therefore, we have no business incentive to try to entice customers to hold out on other products.

Anyway I hope it's sooner as all the hype has expectations pretty over the top for Theia. Also am hoping it's not any larger than the R7 in size. I know many months back something was mentioned about size but I would guess now you know since you know what the case will look like and I assume that means you know the dimensions. My apologies if you already made that known.
We've already said it's larger than the R7 in size. You're getting about 1000x the processing power in about 1.2x the size. If that's too big, I'd recommend just getting the R7 and living with the reduced performance.
 
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Jon at Radenso

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Not sure, but I think [email protected] posted that Theia will be Pro M size but a few mm longer.
It is several mm longer than the Max 360. It's significantly larger than a Pro M (which it should be, since it has arrows).
 

RayC

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We've already answered these questions. 2020, test results will be posted by third parties before pre-orders. The reason you don't understand how this information could be of advantage to competitors is because you don't understand how the market works. If Escort knows our pricing and release date, they would instantly revamp sales incentives, pricing, back end incentive programs, and marketing in response. I guarantee you the R360C would not be priced as high as it is if Escort had known our price point; they shot themselves in the foot and that's exactly the point in keeping this information private. I know rdforum members think a ton of sales happen through manufacturer websites, but that's just not the case. The real war is won out in the retailers - who do not keep up with rdforum.



Actually, .001% of the business is on these forums. Valentine isn't relevant to our business plan since he doesn't sell in any of the areas our main revenue streams are in (B&M, big-box, amazon, etc). It literally doesn't matter if he had the best detector in the world for $199; it would barely ding our revenue. Escort and Uniden are much bigger competitors due to the fact we share sales channels, whereas we do not with Valentine. But realistically, there is a good chance we sell out of the first batch of Theias regardless - therefore, we have no business incentive to try to entice customers to hold out on other products.



We've already said it's larger than the R7 in size. You're getting about 1000x the processing power in about 1.2x the size. If that's too big, I'd recommend just getting the R7 and living with the reduced performance.
Thanks for your responses. Interesting about Valentine. I always viewed them with the G2 release as a legit competitor for the higher priced units regardless of distribution method. I maybe wrongly assumed that once you get into premium priced units people tend to do less impulse buying and a lot more research. I can admit my thought process is not always the norm for buying things. Brand loyalty may drive some to certain brands but unit performance along with features is primary to my choice (size may factor in (thickness more so than length as I like it above the mirror). I do believe I bought the one Radenso directly from your website for whatever reason rather than a retailer and that worked out fine. Maybe some black friday pricing a few years back enticed me at the time to try something new.
 

Jon at Radenso

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Thanks for your responses. Interesting about Valentine. I always viewed them with the G2 release as a legit competitor for the higher priced units regardless of distribution method. I maybe wrongly assumed that once you get into premium priced units people tend to do less impulse buying and a lot more research. I can admit my thought process is not always the norm for buying things. Brand loyalty may drive some to certain brands but unit performance along with features is primary to my choice (size may factor in (thickness more so than length as I like it above the mirror). I do believe I bought the one Radenso directly from your website for whatever reason rather than a retailer and that worked out fine. Maybe some black friday pricing a few years back enticed me at the time to try something new.
Valentine is a legit contender for "best radar detector" for a lot of folks, but "best radar detector" does not always mean best sales. In Valentine's case, that is by choice and not necessity. I am sure the big brick and mortar retailers would love to carry Valentine; he just chooses not to deal with them. As a result, I am sure he has very nice profit margin per unit since he doesn't have to give distributors and dealers a cut.

We have different business models, which is why we are only minimally competitive.
 

lowspeed

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Maybe this has been asked and answered before, but why not have a "pre-order" option that would allow Radenso to keep a credit card and shipping address on file and then they could charge the card and ship the product as soon as units are available?

They probably haven't locked on the pricing yet... I stand corrected. It's to prevent competitors from making moves.
 
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MikePA

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They probably haven't locked on the pricing yet... I stand corrected. It's to prevent competitors from making moves.
Randy already answered why they cannot take pre-orders, accept credit card info, etc. Nothing to do with competitors.
 

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