INFO 2019 South Florida ALP & TMG 1,2,3 Head Comparison and LI Shootout

thebravo

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This was a difficult front end to work with regarding head spacing on a 3 head setup.
ALP was able to squeeze into the small grille with good results. The mounting brackets required for the TMG 3 head setup would never be used in the real world IMO due to being vulnerable to damage and being obvious to LEO's.
Was TMG not functional as a 3 head system within the limits of the Honda grille?
Thanks again for this test. Very enlightening for all of us.

I didn't try the triple TMG inside the grill, based on the manufacturer recommended minimum spacing even the two in there were closer than ideal... doing three would have had the heads way closer recommended Jag felt it would potentially degrade performance... that said the dual did pretty well. there are other cars where you have a little more width of front grill to work with, mine not so much. now you could do some work to cut the bumper or integrate into the headlight assembly if you were doing the full TMG install permanently on the car...
 

TurboDriver

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I didn't try the triple TMG inside the grill, based on the manufacturer recommended minimum spacing even the two in there were closer than ideal... doing three would have had the heads way closer recommended Jag felt it would potentially degrade performance... that said the dual did pretty well. there are other cars where you have a little more width of front grill to work with, mine not so much. now you could do some work to cut the bumper or integrate into the headlight assembly if you were doing the full TMG install permanently on the car...
I think it would have been a very useful test though for knowledge purposes. The "tight" triple is likely how someone would run it if they had a similar grill and believed 3 was better than 2, in fact it has been a question on RDF before.

I have a grill like yours and have it wired for three heads but only connected two because I'm not sure if the third would benefit or make things worse, I will have to test it sometime if I get the chance.

I would also like to see some testing with TMG heads right next to each other separated by a barrier so they cannot "see" each other. I have a feeling that is why there's an interference issue but it hasn't been proven yet.

Thanks for the testing!
 
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Kennyc56

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Thanks for all the hard work! Great testing! Now I know that @VariableWave 's and my testing on my dual TMG G2 heads setup was not a fluke!
 

Eyeborg314

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Interesting to see that a single head TMG was able to jam the Dragoneye slightly whereas it was an IPT on the ALP. My understanding is that ALP has one head receive and the other head transmit, and thus requires at least 2 heads to put up any proper defense against the Dragoneye. I'm curious as to what TMG does, do they do a similar thing as the ALPs or something different with regards to jamming Dragoneye VPR.
 

thebravo

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Interesting to see that a single head TMG was able to jam the Dragoneye slightly whereas it was an IPT on the ALP. My understanding is that ALP has one head receive and the other head transmit, and thus requires at least 2 heads to put up any proper defense against the Dragoneye. I'm curious as to what TMG does, do they do a similar thing as the ALPs or something different with regards to jamming Dragoneye VPR.
There is a full explanation in the higher access areas of the forum, they do indeed have a different approch, it has its limitations and of the two my opinion is ALP is more robust. But for now it works against the guns they have support for and we will see what the VRP head adds once it's out and tested.
 

drtoddw

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@thebravo
Very detailed presentation; thanks for posting this.
 

surprisinguy

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Just saw this... Thanks for the great job and your time on testing - much appreciated!
TMG seems to be working up to awesomeness... Prob going to have to upgrade my G1 heads though.
 

thebravo

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Just saw this... Thanks for the great job and your time on testing - much appreciated!
TMG seems to be working up to awesomeness... Prob going to have to upgrade my G1 heads though.
I'd wait and see what the VPR head brings to the table, that might be the better solution.
 

Choose Life

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I am absolutely taken back by TMG 2 sensor DE results
Either they've done some serious work or
TMG has had access to that gun
Whenever they get an unknown it can really struggle
Bc if TMG did with a gun it did have to study its algo though technically random I wont further it struggles but once they touch it does dramatically better in testing

If it's the same in the wild TMG would do bad about 60-75% of the time

If you get a half dozen 2018 or 2019 Leo DE from all parts of the country and TMG doesn't touch I would shut my fat mouth and call their algo on 2 heads the best you can buy on 2 heads (ALP is zero PTs front and rear when 2rx1tx is used per side tested and set correctly
But TMG improve is amazing I'm just a little iffy with multiple new untouched guns
 

thebravo

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I am absolutely taken back by TMG 2 sensor DE results
Either they've done some serious work or
TMG has had access to that gun
Whenever they get an unknown it can really struggle
Bc if TMG did with a gun it did have to study its algo though technically random I wont further it struggles but once they touch it does dramatically better in testing

If it's the same in the wild TMG would do bad about 60-75% of the time

If you get a half dozen 2018 or 2019 Leo DE from all parts of the country and TMG doesn't touch I would shut my fat mouth and call their algo on 2 heads the best you can buy on 2 heads (ALP is zero PTs front and rear when 2rx1tx is used per side tested and set correctly
But TMG improve is amazing I'm just a little iffy with multiple new untouched guns
TMG has come a long way since last year , they still have guns they don't cover or cover as well. This was also only three passes (1 per left,center,right) so more real world rather than really pushing the PTs out as far as possible with multiple runs drilling into one weak area repeatedly. we were also shooting handheld, now @riseboi has steady hands but still might be able to push the pts further out with a tripod or well braced setup, but again was trying to do a real world type test.... Assuming a typical gun being shot by a typical officer with only one pass to find holes. As long as you aren't in a heavily dragon prone area TMG should be a decent budget solution, ALP is still what I would run in dragon prone areas. And of course this is all subject to change as DE evolves, this was one gun so others will do differently, but it shows that with a good algo they are capable of dragoneye.

I still even feel reasonably ok with LI for many areas, certainly good for rentals when I travel.
 

riseboi

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TMG has come a long way since last year , they still have guns they don't cover or cover as well. This was also only three passes (1 per left,center,right) so more real world rather than really pushing the PTs out as far as possible with multiple runs drilling into one weak area repeatedly. we were also shooting handheld, now @riseboi has steady hands but still might be able to push the pts further out with a tripod or well braced setup, but again was trying to do a real world type test.... Assuming a typical gun being shot by a typical officer with only one pass to find holes. As long as you aren't in a heavily dragon prone area TMG should be a decent budget solution, ALP is still what I would run in dragon prone areas. And of course this is all subject to change as DE evolves, this was one gun so others will do differently, but it shows that with a good algo they are capable of dragoneye.

I still even feel reasonably ok with LI for many areas, certainly good for rentals when I travel.
I've definitely gotten steadier with my aim, but using a tripod makes is so much easier. I'll have a few tripods and a monopod available for use at the upcoming FL winter meetup.
 

Jag42

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I am absolutely taken back by TMG 2 sensor DE results
Either they've done some serious work or
TMG has had access to that gun
Whenever they get an unknown it can really struggle
Bc if TMG did with a gun it did have to study its algo though technically random I wont further it struggles but once they touch it does dramatically better in testing

If it's the same in the wild TMG would do bad about 60-75% of the time

If you get a half dozen 2018 or 2019 Leo DE from all parts of the country and TMG doesn't touch I would shut my fat mouth and call their algo on 2 heads the best you can buy on 2 heads (ALP is zero PTs front and rear when 2rx1tx is used per side tested and set correctly
But TMG improve is amazing I'm just a little iffy with multiple new untouched guns
Thanks for the kind words. TMG has not captured Bravo's DE or @Patton250 DETC that was JTG on another TMG test. TMG has a huge DE library of algos though. Placements are very critical on DE,so some of the Pt's is blamed on not having algos for that gun in the past. I'm excited what the VPR head will bring, its not just for DE,and not gps restricted. The G2 heads are showing good improvements.
 

Bingly

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Thanks for the kind words. TMG has not captured Bravo's DE or @Patton250 DETC that was JTG on another TMG test. TMG has a huge DE library of algos though. Placements are very critical on DE,so some of the Pt's is blamed on not having algos for that gun in the past. I'm excited what the VPR head will bring, its not just for DE,and not gps restricted. The G2 heads are showing good improvements.
Have VPR heads been shipped for testing?
 

Choose Life

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Thanks for the kind words. TMG has not captured Bravo's DE or @Patton250 DETC that was JTG on another TMG test. TMG has a huge DE library of algos though. Placements are very critical on DE,so some of the Pt's is blamed on not having algos for that gun in the past. I'm excited what the VPR head will bring, its not just for DE,and not gps restricted. The G2 heads are showing good improvements.
It definitely has come a long way
With just 2 heads working on DE like that it becomes the perfect rear system and shows promise of being able to run with the top dog
Good job
 

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