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Discussion in 'Stinger' started by Vortex, May 29, 2018.
to be helpful do you know the countries visited or listed, thx
I think you hit the nail on the head - execution, or more specifically results is what matters to customers. If the existing product in customers hands doesn't work, it doesn't matter how clear it is to the company's engineers why it doesn't work, or what secret plans they may have to fix it or come up with a newer, better product. By keeping things secret they create an impression the company is dying and/or product is abandoned.
A while back I heard that the new laser freedom will interface to the VIP somehow to give people the ability to connect more than 4 heads. While it would be a nice option, hopefully that is not the official fix for VIP laser (everyone replace their LAB+heads with new freedom laser) - unless of course the hardware swap is free and they throw in a couple of extra heads to compensate for the cost of re-install.
You know you can run 3 labs off the extender box right?
Which gives you a total of 12 heads.
The post doesn't exist anymore (that I can find anyway), but back in the day on RD.net there was an Australian crane truck driver who had a JTG quad LI setup on that crane, which I always found hysterical. I wonder if he's running a 12 head Stinger these days.
It's going to be interesting to see who ends up being the next US distributor. I have to assume no one knowledgeable about this industry would want to given the current state of their products.
Edit: My mistake. I was thinking you were asking about the LI distributor. *wears the cone of shame*
Written from my mobile device.
I don't think it's supported in the firmware. I inquired a while back about running 5 heads on the front, 3 in the back and was told not supported.
Works fine here when we tested it in AU/EU.
@ Vortex any updates
Nope, nothing yet. I messaged them a few days ago about setting up a time and whatnot, but I haven’t heard back yet.
My guess, and it’s just a total guess, is they want to wait to make sure everything is working well and ready to go so they don’t put themselves in a bind. Once they’re happy with everything, they’ll feel comfortable taking the next step to openly share about whatever it is they’ve been working on.
Hi guys, I have been reading your posts with great interest. I am from the Netherlands and been dealing with the Stinger promises many years now. It seems to be quite an ongoing issue all over the world. Their marketing is fantastic and so is the basis of their hardware. Clever stuff but just not doing what their advertising promises. It is hard to believe they will ever solve the VIP issues for current owners. They don’t do that in Europe so why should they do it in the US? Their hardware developed in 2012 was intended to deal with certain low power K band radars introduced in these years but certainly not with MRCD’s and MRCT’s from later dates.
When it comes to their lidar jammer, it is more or less the same story. Although Fiber optics may sound great for marketing purposes, realize yourself that the laser light has to be transmitted through an aperture of less then a square milimeter and fibers suffer coupling losses. Having said this, you may understand why Stinger laser is unsuccessful against average laser guns in Europe and the US (lack of transmission power). And then I don’t even mention the fact their beam pattern is circular (as a result of using a circular fiber) where you need a rectangular beam pattern (horizontally projected) for the best protection when shot at larger angles.
I am keen to find out what great promises they are going to make Vortex but I am afraid it is going to be copy paste from the past to keep the USA in Wonderland.
Thanks for sharing this information.
Probably something we should all read and consider. There comes a time when reality trumps optimism. I have no stake in the game when it comes to brands, but if I were a betting man Stinger would be the last company I'd put my money on. They just don't deliver the results, and as a forum who provides public info I think it's ok for us to communicate this strongly.
Maybe they will, but until that's actually happening they'll need to prove themselves before I even consider them a serious contender.
Thanks for sharing this information, adds to the overall picture. I hope Stinger reads these comments and actually realizes how their product as a whole stands with the rest.
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This is very helpful, thank you. I appreciate you sharing more of the history and context with Stinger so we can better understand the backstory, lest history repeats itself. It certainly helps me for once I have a chance to speak with them.
Would you mind sharing a bit more about your experience with the VIP in Europe?
I think this will be one of the primary points of discussion: There’s been a lot of promises and issues with the product that failed to deliver. The VIP has/had lots of potential, but what the heck happened with the execution? Moving forward, how can we trust that you will deliver? Whatever you have now that is new or updated, I’m sure it all sounds awesome on paper, but what about in real life with what customers will be running today? Can you deliver now?
X2. I'm very curious to hear what the VIP does well and what it does not do well in Stinger's own backyard, where I would expect them to be at their best.
IF you get that chance to speak to Stinger visitors , darn't post what i really think about them from reading the dutchmans post, feel for Cliff
I'd add one more: What about existing customers? Just on the laser side, the first USA laser solution was so bad they stopped selling it. Then we got the new LAB11 lasers which worked for some, not for others, (seemingly better against Dragon than standard guns). Now it seems like Freedom Laser is the new solution moving forward.
The version of the story most of us heard was that Cliff ate the cost of providing at least free replacement hardware for the first USA laser transition. I don't want to speculate into all the ramifications of that. If it's true, it was very generous even if it's the right thing to do. But still, it does not cover the labor costs of retrofitting the new hardware (not to mention owners of high-end cars are rightfully reluctant to have their cars repeatedly worked on).
It's good that Stinger continuously improves, but having it be at the cost of early adopters and existing customers seems unfair. Everyone who bought the system read the same lofty marketing pages on their website, and I think we're all pretty much on the same page that most of those promises are currently undelivered. That's both wasted money and wasted time, and both are equally important. It costs nearly as much to have a professional install of a high-end radar+laser system compared to the cost of the system itself. And until promises are delivered, customers who paid good money are currently dealing with incomplete or nonexistent protection, and stuck with the dilemma of whether they wait for that mythical update around the corner, or pay even more to rip the whole system out and buy something else.
Yeah that's a really good point @jdong about the installation itself. These aren't windshield mount RD's that take 2 seconds to swap out when upgrading. It's a very involved process, and often expensive and undesirable. Sometimes hardware changes are a part of the process as technology evolves (the ALP adding a Tx sensor is a good example), but not at the cost of existing members. The ALP was improved, but it didn't go from bad to great. It went from great to even greater and I'm sure most people would be cool with that. (Some people still complained about the hardware upgrade nevertheless, but that's understandable.)
Stinger mentioned that they're working on improvements to their existing VIP as well in addition to a new product and I'm really hoping it'll be as simple as a firmware update and then all existing customers will be good to go. I get that hardware does need to change over time to keep up (ie. Escort 8500ci, 9500ci, Max Ci), but if we're going to need Stinger's new system to get all the features and capabilities originally promised in the VIP, a lot of people are gonna be really pissed, and rightly so. What are you guys gonna do with your existing systems? Who'd want them? You could sell them and recoup some money, but the install costs and impacts to your car are a huge deal too...
they can bring out new products which is fine,cant see things really changing on there support side and no product is worth jack S#!!t without proper support, Stinger is a great product but in the wrong hands
Honestly, i think the VIP is one of the easier systems to install. Two firewall penetrations at most. You don't have to use mounting brackets on anything, the laser squares are easy to install and align with tacky. The antennae is ridiculously easy to install in most cases. The biggest bummer, honestly, is that the cables are way to long, considering you could just put the boxes close to where the components will be.
New product for what? They haven't finished their old one. I don't see much of a compromise here. Either their hardware will do the job, or it wont. It's not like there's much in the way of new types of threats. If they need new hardware, then it's a pipe-dream that they'll ever get the old hardware working. (You can't fix hardware with software, unfortunately) And if this ends up being true, they're going to have a hell of a time gaining adoption on the new platform.