MWCTG Test Results for Max360 11/14/2015

Discussion in 'Countermeasure Testing & Related Videos' started by PointerCone, Nov 16, 2015.

  1. PointerCone

    PointerCone M3 Kng Advanced User Premium Member

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    [MENTION=131]GTO_04[/MENTION] and I spent a LOT of seat time with the Max 360 on the "extended" County Road K with many thanks for [MENTION=651]CobawLT2010[/MENTION] for his radar babysitting seat time:

    BUT before the Max 360 results, there's some extra runs on the "old Course" ( that is very tough because of the rise at 1000 feet immediately in front of the radar source) that we made since I was fully equipped that day with all of my units:

    Redline (Old Nelly) v. Falcon HR K Band gun:(Old Course)



    Away from source: 3960 ' feet (.75 miles)

    To source: 4230 feet (.80 miles)

    ** She did pretty well on the away on the K band ***



    Redline Pro A v. Falcon HR K band (segged on K band with Segs # 2 and 3 ON and seg # 1 off)



    To source: Run # 1 : 5016 feet

    To Source: Run # 2 : 5035 feet

    The Pro A did nearly a qtr mile better than Old Nelly on K band (did not run Pro A away from source)



    Max 360 V V V (Highway Mode, TSR OFF, X OFF, Ka ON , K ON, GPS ON, Cruise Alert/Cruise Limit OFF) ON New LONG Range Course:


    Max 360 v. 33.8 Ka (long Course that does not have the rises and falls of the old course)

    Driving away from source (so rear antenna in play here):


    Run # 1 33.8 Ka: 12,672 (2.4 miles)

    Run # 2 33.8 Ka: 11,090 (2.1 Miles)


    Driving TO source 33.8 (so front antenna in play here):


    Run # 1 33.8 Ka: 13,750 (2.6 miles)

    Run # 2 33.8 Ka: 12,720 (2.4 Miles)




    Max 360 v. 34.7 (long Course that does not have the rises and falls of the old course) Note that Radar Source car had BOTH antennas on at this time (34.7)

    Driving away from source 34.7 (so rear antenna in play here):


    Run # 1 34.7 Ka: 13,220 (2.5 miles)

    Run # 2 34.7 Ka: 13,225 (2.5 Miles)


    Driving TO source 34.7 (so front antenna in play here):


    Run # 1 34.7 Ka: 14,260 (2.7 miles)

    Run # 2 34.7 Ka: 14,255 (2.7 Miles)



    Max 360 v. 35.5 (long Course that does not have the rises and falls of the old course)
    Driving away from source 35.5 (so rear antenna in play here):


    Run # 1 35.5 Ka: 10,559 (2.0 miles)

    Run # 2 35.5 Ka: 10,575 (2.0 Miles)


    Driving TO source 35.5 (so front antenna in play here):


    Run # 1 35.5 Ka: 10,580 (2.0 miles)

    Run # 2 35.5 Ka: 10,575 (2.0 Miles)


    ** note here that on the 35.5, the rear antenna and front antenna runs were nearly identical : the M360 did best on 34.7 Stalker which we expected and worst on 35.5. It was very competitive on 33.8 . ***


    K Band v. M360 V V V (Long Course)



    Max 360 v. K band Falcon (long Course that does not have the rises and falls of the old course)

    Driving away from source 24.XX (so rear antenna in play here):


    Run # 1 24. K 4220' (.8 miles)

    Run # 2 24. K 4235' (.8 Miles)


    Driving TO source 24.XX (so front antenna in play here):


    Run # 1 24. K : 6350 (1.2 miles)

    Run # 2 24. K : 6375 (1.2 Miles)



    K Band v. M360 V V V (Shorter, Tougher OLD Course, source at bottom of hill )


    Max 360 v. K band Falcon (short course that does have the rises and falls )

    Driving away from source 24.XX (so rear antenna in play here):


    Run # 1 24. K 1480 (.28 miles)

    Run # 2 24. K 1450 (.28 Miles)


    Driving TO source 24.XX (so front antenna in play here):


    Run # 1 24. K : 2904 (.55 miles)

    Run # 2 24. K : 3125 (.60 Miles)














    One other BONUS RUN on my rear mounted and rear facing M3 Segged Stir-O on 35.5 (ran the M360 mostly due to time constraints): >18480 or >3.5 miles away from source (driving away from 35.5 gun)




    Observations about M360:

    As I stated in another thread, the M360 has some very peculiar behavior with its arrows and bogey (*threat) numbers. It also was much more affected by hill elevations (ups and downs) than other units such as the M3s. ON our lidar testing, the M360 was abyssmal. Truly terrible and did not light up to a single shot from the 4 newer guns except for the TSs that it faced. It was basically BLIND to the new guns. It was mounted low in WS for the lidar testing, just above , BUT not behind the WS wipers. NO tint anywhere near the unit. ALL of my other units in the vehicle for lidar testing alerted to the presence of the new(er) lidar guns, including the O, the Magnum (behind my tint strip), the Pro A and the rear O when I was driving away and getting shot in rear.

    Note too that all other RD units were turned off for radar testing of the M360 to alleviate any allegation of interference. It was place in center of WS just below RVM and had a clear shot of front and rear antennas with no obstructions other than windshield glass and tailgate glass.

    One other bonus that forced [MENTION=131]GTO_04[/MENTION] into my car and NOT to use his car was an errant cow on the old course that had lost his was and was nearly in the street. We do NOT believe that the "old cow" caused any obstructions or affected our results. I guess GTO didnt want to see his very nice new car get damaged. :):)





     
  2. amendolaro

    amendolaro PSL +15 Advanced User

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    What is a Pro A and nelly Kelly?


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  3. Davek

    Davek Premium Member Intermediate User Premium Member

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    I'm not real clear here... sorry. But the reference Redline's where on K band with no Ka reference shown, and your test with 360 on Ka. Maybe I'm missing something here.
     
  4. PointerCone

    PointerCone M3 Kng Advanced User Premium Member

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    Old Nelly is my Redline BSRDR and the Pro A is a 2015 International version of the Redline (called Pro A) that allows for BOTH K and Ka band segmentation. The Pro A is NOT sold in the USA.

    ---------- Post added at 02:52 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:51 PM ----------

    We made some miscellaneous Redline and Pro A and Stir-O runs, BUT my "primary focus" was the newest unit in my arsenal, the Max 360. We also tested the LE10 against Lidar as well.
     
  5. amendolaro

    amendolaro PSL +15 Advanced User

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    Ohh thank you lol


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  6. CCJ22

    CCJ22 Learning to Fly Beginner User

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    So, if I am reading this right (which I wouldn't bet on) the wirebonded STI Magnum w/ BS/RDR and the redline both perform better than this max 360?
     
  7. cihkal

    cihkal Level 3 SA Advanced User Premium Member

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    So given the type of detector the M360 is I'd say those aren't bad numbers. Roughly 2900-3100 feet of K band detection on the tougher course with the falcon.

    Do you think the unit is a significant improvement over the 9500ix? My lingering worry with the 9500ix is the significant delay on K band even in highway mode with TSR on. My wife has pointed out the 9500ix is a little quieter than the M360, but that's not because of better filtering.

    I like that I can have a manageable drive in highway or auto mode with TSR off using the M360. I see moving K I/O in some areas when visiting family so TSR on one of Escort's GPS models tends to be deadly. Obviously an unfiltered Redline is the best option, which I have. This would be my wife's daily detector and will also be in the car we take trips with. I can always run the V1 or Redline, but trying to set up the wifey with decent all around detection without her needing to mess with anything. Tough decision on whether or not to return the M360.

    I've had enough ass time with both detectors to get a decent idea of their differences. What's your thoughts PC knowing that you also have some family members running the 9500ix?



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    Last edited: Nov 16, 2015
  8. PointerCone

    PointerCone M3 Kng Advanced User Premium Member

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    Last edited: Nov 16, 2015
  9. Vortex

    Vortex Making Videos Administrator Premium Member

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    Thanks for doing a bunch of testing with the 360 and great work getting results up so quickly! I totally understand how much time and work is involved. :)

    How well did the other detectors perform on the same course and with the same radar guns as the Max360? Some context and comparison will help us understand how "good" the different detection ranges are. Definitely plenty of warning time realistically against C/O on that course, even against the Falcon HR. I'm curious how much more range the other detectors gave.
     
  10. PointerCone

    PointerCone M3 Kng Advanced User Premium Member

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    The tougher course is our old 1.25 mile course with lots of elevation changes and a hill right in front of radar source. The old course is the "cow course." The long course (see above on Apple Road, aka County K) has some grades, BUT not really enough to block a signal. Its about 4.6 miles long (easier course) and straight as they come.

    Great questions about the iX v. the Max 360. Wife has the 9500iX Pearl and has been using it for about 4 years now since it was released. So does daughter. Occasionally, I'll give wife the V1 .894/5 TMF2 occasionally and she loves the arrows, BUT says (still??) the iX is quieter. I guess for her style and the extensive library of 4 years of lockouts that the iX is sufficient for her. In other words, the iX does the job. Plus, I think that the M360 is too huge for her and she doesnt like a big old RD on her WS. She also doesn't like the black of the V1 either and likes how the "pearl iX matches her car." (which is does to a T). My wife thinks the arrows are "cool" on the 360, BUT she doesn't feel that she needs them . After 4 years, her iX rarely K falses on stationary because it has so many lockouts and she tends to go the same routes. I have her on Highway Mode with TSR ON, so its a relatively quiet unit.

    Tomorrow is one month with my Max and I have mixed emotions. Testing wise, as I explained to [MENTION=131]GTO_04[/MENTION] who rode with me almost the whole time, its what I expected, Max-like performance from the Max 360. No more, no less. BTW, you did read that its abysmal on lidar, cause it IS!! Also, the firmware needs tweaking and sometimes the arrows are a bit "goofy" as if they don't know what to do. The Bogey Counter makes me nuts as it will show 3+ bogey and only one source?? I can see it taking some time to get it dialed in.

    Now, the ultimate question is, IS this unit good enough for a save?? Except on lidar, absolutely yes, it is. More than enough range for that and its quite quick too on IO. You know me, I am M3 spoiled so all of the issues I have with the M360 may not be issues for someone else. Note too that in 99% of cases in my area, a 9500IX is also good enough for a save if you're paying attention.

    ONE final thought, when are YOU going to come testing with us??? WI is not that far away!!

    ---------- Post added at 04:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:57 PM ----------

    Great questions, BUT I do NOT have those results as I was the LONE wolf trying to get my "homework" in........ I can tell you that the O's did every bit as good on radar as the Stinger though and you'll have to ask [MENTION=39]lugnuts[/MENTION] about that.
     
  11. Vortex

    Vortex Making Videos Administrator Premium Member

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    For better or worse, I kinda have to agree. I prefer the performance of the M3's too, but it's not like people with M4's are getting one ticket after another. At the end of the day, is good enough good enough for most? Not for all, of course, but for most? Kind of a weird letdown as an enthusiast who's always reaching for the best experience possible without compromises.

    Gotcha, yeah. Very interesting note about the Stinger matching the O. Curious to hear more sometime, if things were course limited, and so on.
     
  12. reggieb

    reggieb I do what I want Advanced User Premium Member

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    Now that the 9500ci has BS/RDR, I'd love to see it compared to an O and the stinger.
     
  13. PointerCone

    PointerCone M3 Kng Advanced User Premium Member

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    ON the long course, 4.63 miles from source, the Stinger and the O maxed out the course on several alerts. The M360 did NOT max out (no pun intended) any part of the course .

    ---------- Post added at 05:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:12 PM ----------

    I have to believe that the 9500Ci mounted similarly to an O would do near as good as the O. I know that my band segged ci on the stang is very close to my O, BUT not quite there. As to the Stinger, its my opinion (solely) that an O is as good as a Stinger when the Stinger is mounted per factory instruction(s) behind a bumper front and rear. Mounting in cabin or outside, I think the Stinger has an edge. In fact, my Pro A Intl. beat the Stinger at Saturdays meet on some K band alerts.
     
  14. thesilverbullet

    thesilverbullet Clemson Tigers Advanced User Premium Member

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    any m360 Ka testing on the short course? how bad was the short course ka results for the m360?

    can u give the links to previous testing of RL and Max1 Ka results on short course? Also, what is your controller setup for the front and rear stir-0 setup?
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2015
  15. cihkal

    cihkal Level 3 SA Advanced User Premium Member

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    I completely agree with everything you've touched on, I couldn't have said it better than myself.

    Honestly, I think the 9500ix is better for my wife given she doesn't care about some of the extra, but quirky features of the M360. She also doesn't drive aggressive enough that running in highway with TSR on with her 9500ix would cause much of a problem.

    I think if Escort hammers out the issues with the M360 it'll be a great replacement for the 9500ix type of user, just a little pricey. It's sad the damn thing sucks on laser, the 9500ix was decent for me.. and the V1 is overly sensitive if anything.

    Looks like I'll be giving Escort a call tomorrow to make a return

    You know somehow the testing date totally slipped my radar. The wife and I are transitioning from NWI to Chicago so that's been keeping me occupied. I'm for sure attending next year, can't miss another one. I'll be in the city and just a hop away. Plus I can pick up some Wisconsin beer!

    Many thanks to you and everyone else running the tests and putting together the data!

    Sent from my XT1045 using Tapatalk
     
  16. PointerCone

    PointerCone M3 Kng Advanced User Premium Member

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    Yes, it does suck on Lidar and as "everyone" who got in my van and saw the M360 for the first time, "that thing is huge." Bar none, that's what they all said the first time seeing it.

    The iX is actually pretty good on lidar, much better than Max units and not quite as good as V1, BUT very respectable. I was shocked that ALL of the M3s lit up to the newest lidar guns and the Max didnt say a peep. Even the nearly 10 year old O's lit up to the Stalker LR and the Dragon with ease. Must be those 5 sensors they have.
     
  17. Vortex

    Vortex Making Videos Administrator Premium Member

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    Yeah I saw similar results when swapping out detectors for kicks during a laser jammer test... Redline, V1, Max2. Terrible performance with the Max. It would still go off eventually so it technically does work, but a huge step backwards in terms of performance. Thanks for confirming things are the same with the 360.
     
  18. PointerCone

    PointerCone M3 Kng Advanced User Premium Member

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    I only did K on the short course and the Max 360 did pretty poorly compared to the Redline and the Pro A INTL. It's an M5 M6 after all.

    I am not hardwired on the O's and run them off 12V lighters as car is lease. Left controller is front and right is rear. Its pretty logical for me and it actually acts like a V1 when I get an alert. I know exactly where they are when one or the other or BOTH go off.
     
  19. CCJ22

    CCJ22 Learning to Fly Beginner User

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    I am still not seeing any evidence that this 360 performs better than Redline or the wirebonded STI Magnum w/ BSRDR... Or am I confused?
     
  20. fishing66

    fishing66 PSL +15 Advanced User

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    The Max 360 leads all other windshield-mount detectors in price, size and weight. That should count for something, no?