2/23/14 Test: V1, V1C, RedLine, RedLine BS/RDR, Max vs Stalker II MDR 34.7

jdong

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We've seen a lot of excellent tests of these detectors against 35.5, but not as many vs 34.7. Furthermore, there's been some unanswered questions as to how theMax stacks against Factory Default configurations of the V1 and RedLine. I think this is an interesting data point because (1) Not all customers know about how to configure their detectors for optimal detection, and (2) Using V1C Custom Sweeps and BS/RDR does come at the cost of potentially missing out-of-tune guns and increased falses, though in most cases the benefits greatly outweigh the risks.


The Setup

IMG_5013.JPG
map.jpg

This is a popular radar and LIDAR trap that I've seen the local police set up. The PSL in this residential neighborhood is 35mph, but people love to go way faster. In fact, while setting up this trap, I clocked someone going 51 and someone else going 47. Once every month or two, a pair of motorcycle cops go to town and will spend an afternoon pulling over 50+ cars.

The particular trap I chose to set up is around a blind corner, making it utterly hopeless to avoid the trap without CMs. The start of the course is a T junction, that's several curves away.

Test runs were made at least 1 minute apart from each other. If settings were changed, the detector was power cycled. All detectors were mounted at the same location (high) and visually checked to be level from outside. The runs were approximately at 30mph, to the best of my abilities. 2 runs were made with each detector (except the Max, which got a 3rd bonus run)

THE CONTENDERS:
  • Redline: Factory Default Settings
  • Redline: X OFF K OFF RDR OFF, segment 5 only.
  • V1: 3.893, Factory Default Settings
  • V1: 3.893, X off K off Ka guard off, Custom Sweeps 6x34.7 (3 sweeps 50MHz below and 3 sweeps 50MHz above the cutoff point). Configured with a V1Connection LE on an iPhone.
  • MAX: Default settings (X On, K On, Ka on, TSR on, POP off) -- 2 runs in Auto, 1 run in Highway.
The RL and Max were both bought within the last year, both from authorized dealers. The Max was even recently sent back to be tuned up. The V1 was bought 6-7 years ago, but was sent back to VR to be upgraded to ESP about a year ago.


THE RESULTS:

small_map.jpg

  • Overall, it's important to note that settings made a huge difference, and all detectors gave plenty of advance warning. Even the last place detector (the default V1) alerted with 2 more corners until line-of-sight.
  • V1C was the clear winner on this test course. It consistently alerted upon rounding the first curve. This is kind of a shocker, as I expected the RL BS/RDR to win. I did notice, while testing against this gun, the the V1C reaction time was instantaneous to every shot, while the RL BS/RDR had around a ~0.1-0.2s delay and missed shots here and there. I think in this configuration, it's sweeping 34.7 a lot faster than the RL BS/RDR, and that helped give it the edge.
  • The RL BS/RDR was up next, but there was some variance. On one run it performed significantly better than the stock RL. On the other, it performed about the same.
  • The stock RL was next.
  • The Max actually posted some decent runs. It alerted maybe 1-2 seconds after where the stock RedLine alerted, and between the two stock V1 runs.
  • When the V1 was put in factory default settings, it went to dead last place. This is pretty significant -- as I've found that the V1 with Ka Guard Off falses significantly more than the RL BS/RDR.
  • When the V1 on default settings, it went from being first place to last place.
It seems like if your primary threat is 34.7, the V1C is the top dog.


Course Comments:

I'm suspecting, based on videos from the 35.5 runs, that if this course were a mile longer, then we would've seen the RL BS/RDR go off earlier, then lose the signal, reacquire it, etc. But it wasn't really my goal to make any particular detector look good. I just wanted to see how it would fare against a typical speed trap that I see. The course had enough of a challenge to separate the V1C / RL BSRDR from the others, though I would've liked to see a bit more separation from the stock V1/RedLine and Max.

It's clear that as soon as you round that corner, the signal is so strong that all the detectors see it.


The Max / V1 are the worst performing detectors that I own. It'd be curious to see how the M4's would do. But based off my previous experience with the 9500ix vs V1, I'm gonna guess that it won't be a winner.
 

jdong

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Vortex

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We got another tester in da house!! :thumbsup:

I love the presentation on a map like that. Great idea.
 

Vehicle 1

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I like the visual comparison too. Great test, thanks for shearing.

It's good to see that in stock mode all detectors would take care of you in that situation, but that V1C is pretty bad a$$ on 34.7.
 

jdong

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Thanks! Yeah, I found that overlaying all the alert points on the map makes more sense to me. It helps you see how curvature of the road affected the results.
 

tmcmenam

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I really like how you laid out the results on the map. Thank you for this test.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
 

Holla

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Great job!!
 

PointerCone

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Good job. Actually, the 34.7 test has been done with my Max and the segged V1 by Open Road this past summer. Once again, this was a fixed Stalker speed sign, but the results are telling nonetheless. But, as we are fond of saying, your results may vary.

I'd say that against Ka 34.7, the V1 has a better shot against the RL than the Max. I've been running my segged V1 lately and while it's good on Ka, it still lacks the off axis of the Redline.
 

crm

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Great job. Thanks for taking the time to do these tests. Very good information.
 

M42

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Love the map illustration.
 

TheKhosenOne

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Including the map is brilliant idea! :tiphat:
 

protias

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I'm actually surprised the Valentine 1 beat the Redline on 34.7.
 

jdong

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I'm actually surprised the Valentine 1 beat the Redline on 34.7.
Make that two of us. I expected the RL to be the all-bands winner. It's still possible either my RL isn't hot or my V1 is, but given the way my V1 demoted itself down to last place with Ka Guard On, maybe not.

The results were so surprising that after I got back home, I double checked my RL's settings *again* including firing some QT shots at it. It was definitely in RDR off and only seg 5 was on. The gun is 34.714-34.719 according to both the RL and MAX, so it's in tune.


Maybe more 34.7 testing is in order.
 

smokinu454

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Make that two of us. I expected the RL to be the all-bands winner. It's still possible either my RL isn't hot or my V1 is, but given the way my V1 demoted itself down to last place with Ka Guard On, maybe not.

Maybe more 34.7 testing is in order.

I would love to see more 34.7 data for sure since that is my main threat. It looks like they all would have been saves if im reading that map correctly. I was suprised at how consistent the MAX was even though it wasnt good distance.
 

jdong

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I would love to see more 34.7 data for sure since that is my main threat. It looks like they all would have been saves if im reading that map correctly. I was suprised at how consistent the MAX was even though it wasnt good distance.
Yep, all are saves. You can watch the "MAX run 3" video to see how long the course was from virtually the minimum alerting distance. You really only get into the kill zone the moment you round the last corner.

My theory is, if I had some Cobras, early M4's, and Whistlers to test, we would've seen some more detectors that needed another curve to start alerting.
 

smokinu454

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Yep, all are saves. You can watch the "MAX run 3" video to see how long the course was from virtually the minimum alerting distance. You really only get into the kill zone the moment you round the last corner.

My theory is, if I had some Cobras, early M4's, and Whistlers to test, we would've seen some more detectors that needed another curve to start alerting.
This is probably a safe assumption.
 

jdong

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Good job. Actually, the 34.7 test has been done with my Max and the segged V1 by Open Road this past summer. Once again, this was a fixed Stalker speed sign, but the results are telling nonetheless. But, as we are fond of saying, your results may vary.

I'd say that against Ka 34.7, the V1 has a better shot against the RL than the Max. I've been running my segged V1 lately and while it's good on Ka, it still lacks the off axis of the Redline.

Yep, I do remember that test. That was the one that made me expect the RL would win this test. But perhaps if we had instead made this a forward facing instead of a rear facing course, we would've seen the RL with an opportunity to shine.

But the goal of the course was to simulate my drive home every day and a potential threat. I was traveling a speed similar to what I'd usually travel down that road. The RL's inconsistent alerting distance in BS/RDR seems to indicate that it might have caught a blip of the signal earlier had I given it more runs. But given how consistently the other detectors performed (especially the Max), I don't think that would've been fair.
 

hiddencam

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Once again testing variables creating an unexpected result (manufacturing variance, unseen moving traffic along the course, rogue reflections, unseen moving obstacles near the gun, slight mounting angle and/or alignment variances, possible programming errors). It's not the first time this may have happened in a test...and for sure won't be the last! :lol:

It takes a lot of effort to find a course that limits all the variables, and lots of luck once the test starts that variables don't mess with the data.

Video of his runs would perhaps assist interpreting the data, but there's no guarantee of that.

But absolutely, given that course layout, one would expect a segmented Redline to alert earlier than the swept V1. And I'm sure had the course not been so distance-limited we may have seen that. I bet if he drives further West and then North he will eventually find a place that the Redline alerts before the V1. And then more places where the opposite happens. It all comes down to what reflects the radar and whether it's moving, and whether moving things are possibly blocking the signal during the test.
 

jdong

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Once again testing variables creating an unexpected result (manufacturing variance, unseen moving traffic along the course, rogue reflections, unseen moving obstacles near the gun, slight mounting angle and/or alignment variances, possible programming errors). It's not the first time this may have happened in a test...and for sure won't be the last! :lol:

It takes a lot of effort to find a course that limits all the variables, and lots of luck once the test starts that variables don't mess with the data.

Video of his runs would perhaps assist interpreting the data, but there's no guarantee of that.

But absolutely, given that course layout, one would expect a segmented Redline to alert earlier than the swept V1. And I'm sure had the course not been so distance-limited we may have seen that. I bet if he drives further West and then North he will eventually find a place that the Redline alerts before the V1. And then more places where the opposite happens. It all comes down to what reflects the radar and whether it's moving, and whether moving things are possibly blocking the signal during the test.
I really should get a dash cam. I had my phone mounted (pointing towards the right mainly to find landmarks for initial alerts) but it didn't really capture what was going on the road. But the road itself is one curve after another, and really would not have exposed what was going on further down the road. Those videos are posted in the spoiler tag of my 2nd post.

It's certainly possible traffic played a role, but traffic along this road is light on a Sunday at noon, and I was hoping by the 2nd run (or 3rd MAX run at the very end) I would've seen significant variance indicative of some sort of variance related result. I purposely parked my car at the first legal spot before that curve to make sure someone else could not park behind me to suddenly change the test course. Plus, with the sole exception of the RL BS/RDR, everyone else's two runs (including the standard RL) were fairly tightly clustered... within 2 or 3 seconds of each other.

You're definitely right that the distance of the course could be a huge factor. Had it been twice as long, there might've been a point where the RL would've alerted and the V1/Max don't stand a chance of seeing the signal, much like what OpenRoad found on his 34.7 speed sign course. I've seen cases myself, too, where the RL catches a blip of a signal, and then loses it for 15-20 seconds and then it comes back at the exact same frequency to reveal a stationary cop. Maybe had I changed this to a forward-facing test to lengthen the course relatively, then the RL would've had an opportunity to shine.
 

NVBob

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Great job and thanks for sharing your results. There are some really good places up here with no traffic and excellent testing courses. If anyone is in the Reno area or comes through here and wants to do some testing, let me know and I can tell you where some of these good spots are. I need to get a radar gun so I can do some testing.
 

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